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| Hi Guys,
I fish on LSC alot and we have had an influx of illegal guides on the lake. I was hoping to get some ideas on how to stop this illegal activity. I have called the DNR and reported different folks but are there any other things that I can do? Does anyone have any experience with illegal guiding and could suggest some ideas on how to stop it?
Thanks |
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Posts: 1080
| On LSC....contacting the Coast Guard, that is..."IF" they'd even get involved. If not...Conservation Officers? Being it's LSC, I'm under the impression that there needs to be Coast Guard certification for guides out on those waters, so the Coast Guard may very well be interested in getting involved? |
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Posts: 1141
Location: NorthCentral WI | Excuse my ignorance, but what makes them "illegal"? |
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| They get busted and then go right back to doing it again. All they ever get is a slap on the wrist and you're never going to stop it until the penalties and fines become serious enough to keep them from doing it again. There is too much money to be made and up until the point where a fine outweighs a few days on the water or their boats are seized it will never end. I know of one who got popped for no boat inspection this summer and they're already back on the water. It's a losing battle. |
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Posts: 247
Location: Uxbridge Ontario | Only thing that I know of; I you take people out on the water for muskie you need 2 things. A charter license and be insured as a charter.
Am I missing anything? I am not sure how you can look at a boat and call them illegal though.??? |
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Location: Contrarian Island | there are guides from the states guiding up there without a Charter/Captains license... and I'd bet they aren't carrying the proper insurance.... some will always try to skirt the rules. but it always catches up with them...
Edited by BNelson 9/16/2011 10:10 AM
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| What if your friends with a guide and you fish together on LSC? The guide is not doing business, we're just a couple of friends fishing together, are they considered illegal Schram?
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Posts: 299
| It's a whole other ballgame when it comes to getting licensed on Great Lakes System. I'm sure Chad Sandy or Jon Bondy who are both licensed guides can explain the actual strict requirements and cost when it comes to becoming a guide out on LSC. I agree the rise of illegal guiding has been noticed out on this body of water. If this is Schram who started this new topic then I'm surprised because I recently heard the DNR caught up with you? I also know that at times you didn't have all the required equipment to be taking clients out. I'd like to think that you have straightened all this out and are on the right track but that's not what I've seen?? The best we can do is continue to call the DNR if we see violations. Keep calling and these guides will be stopped. Figure out where they fish at certain times of the season and notify authorities. It will catch up with them again. To get licensed on an International body of water is much different that an inland lake. Chad or Jon chime in on what it really takes to become a licensed guide and to keep renewing year after year. |
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| MartinTD - 9/16/2011 9:17 AM
Excuse my ignorance, but what makes them "illegal"?
Guiding on navigable water they need a USCG captain's license, full boat inspection and associated plainly visible issued decal, drug testing and then the state regulations. Most of the guides on LSC don't have any or all of these things. Some do, most don't. |
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Posts: 2037
Location: lansing, il | What are you looking for here??? Contact the authorities turn over all the info you may have and let them deal with it. If your not happy with the answers they give you take it to a higher level.
or
If that doesnt work, Ive also heard that Facebook is a good place to duke it out like 3rd grade girls. |
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Posts: 380
Location: Michigan | US Coast Guard Issued OUPV (6-pack) Charter Captains License
Michigan DNR Boat Inpsection
Commercial Liability Insurance
Certification in First Aid & CPR
Participation in Random Drug Testing Program
If you don't have these items or they aren't current, you risk fines by either the DNR or the Coast Gaurd.
Edited by Chasin50 9/16/2011 10:10 AM
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| This topic is funny to me, because who really cares? If someone wants to go out and try and make a living then i am all for it. I sit here and laugh at all the guides who start crying basically when someone else shows up on there body of water. I see it every year up here in Bemidji and it makes me really laugh. It even gets to a point where one "local" guide up here has began trying to cut the other guides off on every spot while they are guiding. Only person hes peeing off is the clients... Good luck possibly booking them in the future. Go fish have fun and hopefully put someone else on a monster fish. |
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Posts: 743
| what's worse: guiding without proper paper work, or guiding the first year you have boat? just because you finally bought a boat doesnt mean you are good guide. |
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Location: minocqua, wi. | muskihntr - 9/16/2011 9:58 AM
What are you looking for here??? Contact the authorities turn over all the info you may have and let them deal with it. If your not happy with the answers they give you take it to a higher level.
or
If that doesnt work, Ive also heard that Facebook is a good place to duke it out like 3rd grade girls.
if it's someone's home water where they make a living and the competition isn't in compliance ... why isn't it fair to call it out on a forum that't the #1 source in all of musky fishing?
kinda like arguing against bait and tackle-makers who doesn't register their business and pay their rightful taxes????
looks like a fair topic to me. |
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Location: Northern Wisconsin | Mike - 9/16/2011 10:03 AM
This topic is funny to me, because who really cares? If someone wants to go out and try and make a living then i am all for it. I sit here and laugh at all the guides who start crying basically when someone else shows up on there body of water. I see it every year up here in Bemidji and it makes me really laugh. It even gets to a point where one "local" guide up here has began trying to cut the other guides off on every spot while they are guiding. Only person hes peeing off is the clients... Good luck possibly booking them in the future. Go fish have fun and hopefully put someone else on a monster fish.
Yes I agree, there is no problem with someone going out and trying to make a living but they are doing it ILLEGALLY. It's not fair for those who take the time and money to actually get the required certification to become a guide. |
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Location: New Hope MN | Sounds like another typical barrier to entry regulation... |
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Location: NorthCentral WI | muskihntr - 9/16/2011 9:58 AM
If that doesnt work, Ive also heard that Facebook is a good place to duke it out like 3rd grade girls.
LMAO. That was good.
But seriously, random drug testing for guides is pretty laughable. Whoever made that part of the requirement needs a reality check.
I don't see this topic lasting long anyways.
Edited by MartinTD 9/16/2011 10:22 AM
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| Where did muskihntr defend anyone, let alone the person mentioned here? Seems he just offered up advice on the proper channels to go through. Seems pretty reasonable to me. |
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Location: Racine, Wi | MartinTD - 9/16/2011 10:13 AM
muskihntr - 9/16/2011 9:58 AM
If that doesnt work, Ive also heard that Facebook is a good place to duke it out like 3rd grade girls.
LMAO. That was good.
But seriously, random drug testing for guides is pretty laughable. Whoever made that part of the requirement needs a reality check.
I don't see this topic lasting long anyways.
That's a Coast Guard requirement for people with Captain's licenses I believe (I could be mistaken, but when looking into captain's licenses, I've come across that, and from talking with friends who are captains, they've mentioned that.) |
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Posts: 574
| MartinTD - 9/16/2011 10:13 AM
But seriously, random drug testing for guides is pretty laughable. Whoever made that part of the requirement needs a reality check.
I don't see this topic lasting long anyways.
Really? Your life is in their hands.. On a huge dangerous body of water...
Its not random testing for "guides" Its random testing for "Great Lakes Captains"
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Posts: 299
| Why would anyone think it's completely "ok" to head out and illegally guide on waters where "Real" guides go through the proper channels. On any water there's a lot of responsiblity to keep your clients safe. It's not all about putting people on monster fish. Some guys make a living guiding and it's very important to get the proper documentation to be a licensed guide.
It is funny to see guys fish a 430sq mile lake like LSC only after 3 seasons and decide to guide. |
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Almost as funny as some MN guides who fished the lake once before they decided to guide there..
Hey now, that's a low blow...I'm pretty sure those Hayward guys put at least 2-3 days in before they started guiding the St Louis River.... |
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Posts: 618
Location: Bloomington, MN | Would a Charter Captain's license be required to guide on the St. Louis River? |
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Location: lansing, il | Im not defending or standing up for anyone that is 100% sure, especially on this topic. Print that if you like. I just questioned why it was put up on here and now its obvious. The laws are the laws, and if your going to do whatever your gonna do you need to follow them. If you see someone breaking the law report them to the correct authorities and let the law deal with it. There really isnt anymore that can be done. |
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| OUCH! |
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Posts: 897
| Clark A - 9/16/2011 10:42 AM
Would a Charter Captain's license be required to guide on the St. Louis River?
Yes, a Captain's license is required on the St. Louis River and a LOT of other lakes/rivers in MN. I think the real concern, outside of insurance to cover potential catastrophe's, should be whether these guides are paying taxes to the states where they are guiding. I don't care if you guide wherever as long as you pay taxes on the money you make exploiting the state's resource. Guessing the VAST majority of guides do NOT pay taxes or contribute much to the resource. |
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Illegal Guides