Posted 12/5/2010 5:01 PM (#469083) Subject: Going to a deep V Which one?
Hey Guys,
Im getting rid of my esox mag and am going to a deep v and have been looking for a while but dont know what to do. I dont need a big boat but am tired of not being able to go out on LOTW at least one day of my trip over the last three years. Just want to be able to get out in three footers and find fishable water. Its going to be a tiller boat for sure and have been looking at the tuffy 1760 and 1700, 1650 alumacraft navigator, 1675 lund pro guide, and the new 1650 pro tiller from crestliner. There are no tuffy dealers near me but all three of the other brands are within an hour... I like the bigger back decks on the crestliners and alumacrafts. The rod lockers in all but the tuffys are worthless as far as im concerned for the longer rods we use now a days. just looking for any experiences you guys have positive or negative...
Thanks
Rick
Posted 12/5/2010 5:49 PM (#469093 - in reply to #469087) Subject: Re: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 3479
Location: Elk River, Minnesota
Hiya,
I have the Alumacraft Navigator 1650 and I love it!! It has a 90 inch beam and is 16'-7" long. Very deep and very stable. I have the console version and even with the console, there is a bunch of floor space, two rod lockers, and the ability to go 24 volt on your trolling motor system.
I know the newer versions of the boat have rod tubes, and I would suspect they have not changed the length of the rod locker, you can fit an 8 foot rod in the port side locker. I have been able to weasel in an 8'-6" rod in mine, but the rod tip extends into the front storage compartment past the livewell.
This is a rock solid boat!! 2xb hull system, 23 gallon gas, and very very very easy to rig yourself for electronics.
Posted 12/5/2010 8:32 PM (#469126 - in reply to #469083) Subject: Re: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 485
Location: On my favorite lake!
I have the 165 alumacraft dominator and it is stable. I love the boat very well built. I have a 90 hp on it. It also has decent storage. I liked the thicker sides because it was easy to mount rod holders and plates for down riggers. I have taken te boat on lake Michigan with no problems. Just have to be careful with all boats out there.
Rick
Posted 12/5/2010 9:25 PM (#469134 - in reply to #469083) Subject: RE: Going to a deep V Which one?
Thanks guys,
I really like the layout of the alumacrafts too. I have heard about the quality of alumacrafts but of course all the companies say they make the best boat on the market... I think that a 1650 v hull will handle chop much better than the esox mag even though aluminun. Three footers tend to go over the front pretty easily. I have fished out of the lund outfitters and they get the job done but are pretty narrow and no rear decks to speak of. Im interested in the rear decks because i usually fish from the rear of my own boat when with my usual fishing partner. He likes to run trolling motor and i like not having too...
Steve you are on the tuffy team right? I have looked at the 1760 and 1700 which hull do you like better and for what reasons?
Thanks
Posted 12/5/2010 9:58 PM (#469151 - in reply to #469083) Subject: Re: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
The 1760 T is a great rig for all waters, and will handle 3' seas well. The 1700 will no longer offered as a tiller as of 2011
Real 3' waves on LOTW or almost anywhere are one heck of a challenge for any 16' class boat, waves like that make walleye tournament directors nervous enough to consider cancellation of the day. If you are really out in 3' waves quite a bit out there, look at the Lund 1750 class models too.
Posted 12/5/2010 10:04 PM (#469154 - in reply to #469151) Subject: Re: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 1663
Location: Kodiak, AK
sworrall - 12/5/2010 10:58 PM
Real 3' waves on LOTW or almost anywhere are one heck of a challenge for any 16' class boat, waves like that make walleye tournament directors nervous enough to consider cancellation of the day. If you are really out in 3' waves quite a bit out there, look at the Lund 1750 class models too.
Agreed. Most folks (not saying anyone in this thread) overestimate the seas. 3'ers are going to be tough in any boat in the teens. I see 3's and 4's often enough on LSC in my 20' and I don't get nervous, but get real serious, real fast. I wouldn't want to do 3'ers in a 16-18' tiller, or even many consoles for that matter, in honest 3'ers. I say go big and go wide....applies to many things in life.
Posted 12/5/2010 10:16 PM (#469160 - in reply to #469154) Subject: Re: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 642
Location: Richfield, MN
I like my Crestliner Mirage 20'.... Handles most waters very well including 20 mph winds on Millacs!!!!!!! You just might get a little wet with the waves created by that kind of wind!!!!
But the boat handles great. It is a console tho and not a tiller.
Posted 12/6/2010 7:10 AM (#469184 - in reply to #469083) Subject: Re: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 3479
Location: Elk River, Minnesota
Hi everyone,
I would agree that any boat for muskies in 3 foot seas is going to be a challenge. It is very interesting to see how people consider 3 foot seas... Two arguments are made as to how waves are measured: From what would be considered calm surface (midway between valley and crest) to crest, or from valley to crest.
If memory serves me correctly, a wave is measured from the center of the wave to the crest, as it would be stated through the coast guard, NOAA, etc. Thus, a 3 foot wave would actually be roughly 6 feet from valley to crest, or reaching close to 1/3 the length of many boats out there and for something like mine, almost 40% of the overall length. That is a very large swing and with most boats that size, unfishable via casting methods.
I've been in some pretty big rollers with mine, worst being out on Chequamegon Bay a couple of years ago where I had a passenger behind me taking pictures of the water behind the boat that was above his head by quite a bit...and this was in following seas. The boat did really well, and going with the seas that large is not the safest in the world since most swampings come from the rear of the boat...
Posted 12/6/2010 8:54 AM (#469192 - in reply to #469083) Subject: RE: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 7037
Location: Northwest Chicago Burbs
"The rod lockers in all but the tuffys are worthless as far as im concerned for the longer rods we use now a days. just looking for any experiences you guys have positive or negative..."
Just a comment here: I run a 1760GC, and the rod locker can hold two 8'6"ers and 10 8'ers.
whynot
Posted 12/6/2010 9:33 AM (#469198 - in reply to #469184) Subject: Re: Going to a deep V Which one?
VMS - 12/6/2010 7:10 AM
If memory serves me correctly, a wave is measured from the center of the wave to the crest, as it would be stated through the coast guard, NOAA, etc. Thus, a 3 foot wave would actually be roughly 6 feet from valley to crest, or reaching close to 1/3 the length of many boats out there and for something like mine, almost 40% of the overall length. That is a very large swing and with most boats that size, unfishable via casting methods.
FYI, NOAA measures wave height from trough to crest. Figured that one out before a trip to Stannard Rock this summer.
Posted 12/6/2010 12:35 PM (#469215 - in reply to #469083) Subject: RE: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 131
LOVE MY 1760 TILLER!had it in some nasty crap you won't most guys were smart enuf to stay out of and it handled it.you won't find a more solid hull in a same size boat.
Posted 12/6/2010 4:03 PM (#469238 - in reply to #469215) Subject: RE: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 1023
I love my crestliner 1650 - handles good size waves well - I feel safe in it. Well constructed and laid out but the rod storage in my 2007 stinks compared to my 2003, which held rods up to 9 feet.
Landry
Posted 12/10/2010 6:29 PM (#469923 - in reply to #469083) Subject: Re: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 148
Location: Northwest Wi.
I also have the Tuffy 1760 GC and I really do like the the ride. I fish everything from Mille Lacs to your small sunfish lakes. In three footers and even more I have never taken water over the bow under OB power but you will take on water in heavy waves using the bowmount. I used to have the 1700 G-Tiller but went with the 1760GC now as it's a little better on the old body in big water. I am very happy with this boat because it will handle the big stuff with a ride you get only with glass and is easy to put in the smaller lakes, also only one axel on the trailer.
Edited by pitch'n 12/10/2010 6:32 PM
Rick
Posted 12/10/2010 7:15 PM (#469927 - in reply to #469083) Subject: RE: Going to a deep V Which one?
I agree real three footers are a big deal if your not careful in most boats. I have filled boats with water two times in my life; once on leech lake in a deep v from behind, and my esox mag from the front on LOTW... These are the type of things im looking for. I have heard many times that aluminum boats get pushed around more in the wind than fiberglass but i cant really understand why if they are similar in weight and height out of the water. My esox is the best boat I have ever fished out of 90% of the time. But when its rough it kills me to watch other boats out cruising around just knowing the fish are probably on fire. Thats why I really want a deep v.
Posted 12/11/2010 8:36 AM (#469971 - in reply to #469083) Subject: Re: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
Watch for the introduction of the new X176 this model year.
Rick
Posted 12/11/2010 10:28 AM (#469987 - in reply to #469083) Subject: RE: Going to a deep V Which one?
I know that was on another thread earlier the x 176... But tuffy is so dang slow on their website it is rediculus. They still call it the new x 190 and that has been out for several years. there is still stuff from 2006 on the site as news! They said that new brochures would be out in december but i will have to see that to believe it. It sounds like they wont have one in Chicago though and that is usually the only show I can get to being from down south...
Posted 12/11/2010 11:22 AM (#469997 - in reply to #469083) Subject: Re: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
The X190 is the newest Tuffy model, and underwent a serious facelift for 2011.
The brochure is at the Advertising Agency in process now. The new Fiberdome website is currently under construction and getting close to completion (www.fiberdome.com), and after some tweaks there, the new Tuffy website will go into production. There will always be news and information from previous years on it, though...just like here.
There's nothing new right now to add to the website about the new 2011 models anyway, because they are not yet released for public viewing. According to Fiberdome, the new X170T and the 21' model will be at the Tri Esox show.
The order the new models are being produced:
21' Osprey/Esox Deep V-- Hull;done--deck insert; done- cap; in process
X170T--hull mold; done--deck insert/cap; in process
X176 Osprey/Esox Deep V--scheduled to begin after X170T is complete, ready for late winter show release
Building all new tooling is a process, not an event.
Posted 12/11/2010 4:22 PM (#470050 - in reply to #469997) Subject: Re: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 82
Location: Cottage Grove, Mn
Hello,
What is the deadrise of these 2 new "Deep Vs" and why is deadrise never mentioned in freshwater boats? We talk about storage , water spray and going out in 4 footers but rarely mention the very thing that allows a smooth ride.
I may be wrong but the last "Deep V" I remember was the Champion 190. As Steve has previousily mentioned it was a superior riding hull in rough water.
Dennis
Posted 12/11/2010 5:08 PM (#470055 - in reply to #469083) Subject: Re: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
By definition, the 2060, 1890, 1760, and 1700 are all deep V hulls, but the deadrise modifies from the entry point at the bow to the lift strakes at the rocker and pad on the 1760 and 2060, which qualifies the hulls as a 'high performance Deep V' correcting the problems associated with true V hulls. So are the Ranger Fisherman series hulls and the original Champ hulls. The Champ Fish Hunter is a good hull for sure. Not sure on the deadrise on the new 21, I'll check on it.
guest
Posted 12/11/2010 5:36 PM (#470059 - in reply to #469083) Subject: RE: Going to a deep V Which one?
Does anyone know if you can order a tuffy boat right form fiberdome or do you have to go through a dealer?
Posted 12/11/2010 7:00 PM (#470074 - in reply to #469083) Subject: Re: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
Have to go through a dealer. A dealer can arrange for you to pick up a boat and trailer there, or have it delivered to you, but not if there is an engine on the rig unless the dealer has done the due diligence for registration.
Rick
Posted 12/12/2010 1:54 PM (#470202 - in reply to #469083) Subject: RE: Going to a deep V Which one?
What do you guys think about the the Skeeter wx 1790? Looks like a pretty deep boat. there is no back deck but plenty of room to build one... I don't really know anything about their deep v. Looks like true deep v and not very flared i wonder how it would ride...
Posted 12/12/2010 2:05 PM (#470208 - in reply to #469083) Subject: Re: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 32880
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
Skeeter builds a nice rig; the hull is a hybrid of the same hull Yar Craft used to sell and does still in a model or two and the ride is good. Check rod locker length, and look over other things like front deck size, etc. as a muskie guy. The boat is built in Kilgore, Texas, and the company is owned by Yamaha. I used to work for them, actually, and introduced the Skeeter V models in the Midwest.
lambeau
Posted 12/12/2010 2:29 PM (#470215 - in reply to #469083) Subject: RE: Going to a deep V Which one?
Skeeters are known for being smooth in rough water, they do have quite a deep V.
interestingly enough, Skeeter is coming out with a new "MX" series this year, targeting the multi-species and muskie market with a casting/bassboat style interior on a semi-deep hull. it'll be interesting to see how it finally looks, but is sure sounds a lot like the very successful Tuffy X-190. taking notes, were they?
as an aside, the X-190 is not a "deep" V, rather a hybrid v-hull somewhere between the flatter bassboat style hulls and the bigwater deep Vs. it's an awesome ride on most any water under the relatively calm conditions of summer and it'll get you into those small shallow lakes too. when compared to true big deep-V hulls, it's a rougher ride and demands more skillful driving when things get rough on big water, but it will get you home safely. it's an awesome combination of fishability (especially for casting muskie baits) and ride that allows you to do a LOT of different applications on a wide range of waters.
for a mid-size true deep-V, the Tuffy 1760 is a great choice. fishing-focused interior layout and storage for casting and trolling, and a wave-cutting ride that will get you there and back again without beating you up.
here's some cool video of a 1760 playing in the wind and waves...
(would love to embed the video it but it keeps listing "HTML: No" to the side over there and there's not an option to enable it in the Control Panel. Steve???)
Posted 12/13/2010 7:52 PM (#470459 - in reply to #469083) Subject: RE: Going to a deep V Which one?
I am looking at buying a new boat either next year or the following. Looking at buying something in the 17.5 foot class and have been looking at the Navigator in that size. This is the boat I would use when I retire in a couple years and move to where we have a cottage now. Looking at aluminum for two reasons: one, shallow channels on our lake chain, and two, want a lighter boat that I can trailer by myself to other lakes. I am in good shape now but know that no matter how much I work out I will lose strength eventually and that moves me toward the aluminum boat. Again, this is a boat for my retirement.
One consistent negative I read about aluminum boats is that they don't handle the wind as well as glass. My question is that with a boat like the Navigator, which has a very large live well up front, can you compensate for the wind issues but filling the live well and adding almost 300 pounds to the center front of the boat? Any advice would be appreciated.
Edited by North of 8 12/13/2010 8:00 PM
Rick
Posted 12/19/2010 10:00 PM (#471218 - in reply to #469083) Subject: RE: Going to a deep V Which one?
OK Here's a couple more questions... if I have to go aluminum
Welded or riveted?
Do any of you guys have experiences with the lund IPS and IPS2 hulls? Does the 2 have a better ride?
Posted 12/29/2010 3:30 PM (#472516 - in reply to #469083) Subject: RE: Going to a deep V Which one?
Posts: 82
Location: Cottage Grove, Mn
Here's pictures of my favorite Deep V hull! Tuffy should build one of these for
bigwater fishing..........I could then have another Tuffy for another 18 years.
24 degree transon deadrise, North Carolina flare. No pad!
Going to a deep V Which one?
