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Posts: 305
| anyone use flaptails with any frequency? favorite situations, retrieves, and brand of lure? maybe this has been discussed here before...couldn't find much. |
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Posts: 268
| had great luck with them this year on the Wisconsin River in many of the different flowages. I use them on overcast days and lowlight situations w/ calm conditions, I normally use a real slow steady retrieve with flaptails, I use 2 models that I make myself a 4 1/2 inch w/ spreader hooks and a 6 inch w/o spreaders. I like black firetail and black orange lace both have nicklel blades. |
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Posts: 303
| Buy a Joel Wick....or a Ry Lure |
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Posts: 4266
| I make my own "Beaverturds". I'll use them anywhere that I'd throw any other topwater. Keep the rod tip low and reel just fast enough to get the blade to kick out of the water. You don't want the blade to spin constantly, however that is a good feature when a fish follows and you go into a figure 8. |
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Beav makes a good one. I used to make my own, basically a 2/3 size Snodlow. The hanger I used for the blade was a strip of steel bent at a 90 degree, drill for two screws for the body and one for the hanger. I used a .030 wire with the end bent over and stuck into a hard plastic bead while very hot ( melted into the bead interior), ran the wire through the hole in the hanger, and wrapped the blade on, then trimmed off the excess.
Used to call it Dog Turd, named so by Jim Bagley from Bagley Baits a very long time ago, but that's another story. I had one that put over 100 muskies in the boat. Had it refinished a while back. |
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Posts: 1348
Location: Pewaukee, WI | I've personally had very good luck with the Top H20 from Lee's Lures. THis thing is well built and has great action!  |
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Posts: 305
| love the names and stories! your bait and its construction sounds interesting, steve. and beaver, i hear you have a megaturd. would u guys be willing to share photos...and opinions on leaders for these? and the rest of you, keep the info coming...anyone fish these in rough water? |
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Posts: 1287
Location: WI | Corey Meyer makes a really nice flaptail. |
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| top h20 by Lee isn't a flaptail....Ryan Jinkerson makes a sweet one...if you can get your hands on one...they are nice...sweet sound |
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| JD Splasher by Jim Dembiec. |
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Rough water or calm, Turds catch fish from opener to close. The 'original' was a Heddon Vamp Flaptail. HiFin built one called a Splash Tail, and I talked them into the solid leader on the front to hold the lure steady during the retrieve like the Snodlow has. The best? Dave Snoddy's Snodlow, absolutely no question. He used the same brass nail to secure the tail the originals used, the head of the nail rode against the hanger and the nail was 'looped' to close off the connection to the blade.
I came up with the wire through the rear of the bait back in the early 80's because I missed so many fish that hit the rear of the bait without getting hooks. I'm not sure how many of the present day lures have this as a standard feature. I drilled one hole al the way through one of Snoddy's lures, and another about an inch forward about 1" deep. Bend a wire in a 90 long, and another 90 at 1"X1", that allows the short end to pound into the body and the long end to stick through; seal with epoxy. Wrap a small, sharp treble on the 'stinger wire', and you won't miss many anymore.
I bet Jim's JD Splasher is modeled after that lure; we did fish a bit together during his earlier years. He is crazy about his lures running right, so he has it correct... |
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Posts: 288
Location: Montreal, Que. Canada | Hi Steve,
Would you mind putting up a picture of an example of one like your talking about?
Thanks,
David |
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Posts: 2270
Location: SE, WI. | From a recent batch made...here you go!!!  If Steve only heard this one!!!
Edited by jdsplasher 12/9/2009 5:44 PM
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Posts: 4266
| I started making my own Turds when I was just a little baby boy
I have several styles, but this is my favorite even though they all have caught fish. The more I used them and played around with different designs I settled on this on for a few good reasons.
First, it's not small like most of the other Turds that I see floating around. Bigger diameter moves more water. I weight them so that they sit a little lower in the water than most, this gives them a good push of water, that and the flat face.
Secondly, I found that if you positioned the blade a little farther back, you added 2 new movements to a lure that most guys think are too boring. With the blade farther back, it actually will move the butt of the lure an inch or more from side to side when the blade kicks out. At the same time the blade kicks out and the butt moves, the lure will roll a little on it's side giving life to a dead lure.
The way that I attach the blade to get the extra length started with a barrel swivel but has graduated to a section of bead-chain. I use a round bend hook in the front and T it, and I've gone to a double hook in the back so I can use a bigger hook without having it get in the way of the blade or chain.
I've tried several types of wood, but pine seems to come out the best when it comes off of the lathe. I thought cedar would work well too but the guy who did the lathe work complained about too much splintering. I might have to find someone from the basement to make cedar bodies for me to see if it will last longer. Even with sanding sealer and 3 coats of ETex, even pike can get through to the wood.
I LOVE TURDS!!
Edited by Beaver 12/9/2009 8:41 PM
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Posts: 4266
| OOPS Forgot the picture. This is the Megaturd body. 7" long, 1 1/2'' diameter at the head tapered to 7/8 at the butt.
Edited by Beaver 12/9/2009 9:51 PM
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Posts: 305
| I'm starting to love 'em too. turd stories are great. c'mon beav, show us your big fat turd. |
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Posts: 305
| impressive...thanks. is there a place for the mega with more motion/water push vs. the smaller, stiff wired, closer bladed splasher and if so where does each shine? how are hookups with the mega...as good as splasher with its drop wire? |
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Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Jim, nice job, that looks great.
How the bait got the name:
Back in the 80's, Bagley Baits was interested in some of the lures I was building. Jim Bagley booked me on Pelican for a few days, and we fished dawn to dark. Sometime during the second day, I believe, I pulled out my favorite surface bait, which had already put a ton of fish in the rig. I was running K-Dee trailers under my Tuffy boats at that time, and a can of touch up paint was standard. My trailers had been brown, tan, and dark brown. I used the spray paint to touch up that lure, and it was....mottled from use and scarred from multiple fish. When I pulled out the lure, Jim asked me what the heck it was, and I told him I had no name for it. He said, 'Well, I have a couple hunting dogs, and if that was in my front yard, I wouldn't step on it!"
Poof, it's called a Dog Turd. |
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Posts: 4266
| I throw it anywhere under any conditions. I've never seen a place where it really blew away other top water lures, but I like to throw it in very shallow rocky areas and around milfoil. It's also a great lure for beginers because they don't have to worry about how to work the lure. I gave a few to some different guides a few years ago, and the consensus was it was a great lure for rookies and that they did better in the back of the boat than the front. I was surprised that all 3 made the same back of the boat comment which makes me think......follow-up lure, tournament lure/ heavy pressure lure. More hook ups on the front hook than the rear. When they eay it, they schloop it right up. JIM??????
Edited by Beaver 12/9/2009 9:52 PM
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Yes they do! Beav's lures are unique and well made, and this one catches fish. |
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Location: SE, WI. | Beav your turd looks like a turd from Mars...LOL...looks like some kind of firefly.
I like a more simple action. I do not want my rear wiggling like you like it to. I want my lure coming in straight and easy for fish to hit. If the ass end is wiggling, fish might miss it. We have many opinions.
I also like the blade nice and tight to the lure. Reason being...3 things. When blade is set back, the blade tends to do the spinning thing more under water than the flipping out. 2nd I like the blade tight because of the brass, peened cap on the rear of my turd . Blade being close to body creates the clicking metallic and pinging sound from blade kicking up and contacting the brass cap. 3rd, I like the blade closer to my hooks, which should give you better hookups. Fish locks onto sonics, then attacks the moving part which is the blade/body!
Many guys now are putting a metal bead in the rear of their flaptails to create the clicking sound, which I starting doing back in the 80's After fishing with Mr Steve.
I also put rattles in some of my pine bodies!!
I like the turd application more with a chop than calm conditions. I believe there is some kind of contrast in sound with the noise of a chop, and noise from the flaptail. I never did real good fishing flaptails in a calm condition. I think there are better baits to throw in the calm waters. I also like casting flaptails over boulders. I feel that blade noise seems to draw fish in from further away. I think the blade sound bounces off the rocks and enhances the sonics.
By the way...I still remember Mr. Worrall missing 2 that day on turds. I think he did not wait till he felt the Weight!  What you think gramps?
Edited by jdsplasher 12/10/2009 7:37 PM
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Yep. Took me YEARS to get rid of the instant 'Creature' hookset. |
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Posts: 4266
| The butt of mine does move when the blade kicks out, but not enough to make a fish miss it. When I went to the bead chain, I got a lot more 'kick outs' per retrieve. The speed of your retieve has more to do with getting kicks vs. spinning, that's why older people are better at working flaptails. I must disagree with you about fish hitting the moving part. If that was the case, fish would hit bucktail blades more than the body. Maybe I should go with current trends and build a turd with 2 huge blades! I think that the bigger profile of my turds makes them a better target, especially in any conditions that aren't flat calm. |
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Location: SE, WI. | Actually beav, I built a turd with two blades back in the 80's. The sonics are unbelievable. Double brackets. I just have to have some tricks for myself...
As for the moving parts, The sound comes from the blade more so than the body coming through the water. (Steves trailerHook how succesful it was)! So musky will tend to hit short, especially when the sound is in the rear. Bucktail hair, tinsel, skirting, and maribou all undulate and display a moving part, thus musky again tend to attack from the back because they are chasing. I have to say though since the DCG's came out, I hear of more musky attacking the blades...hitting 2 and 3 times before a hookup.
Going back to rear sounding baits, and they do catch fish...BUT that is why I built the headbanger, a front rotating thumper style that sounds come from the front of the lure hoping I will get less short strikes. I simply, for my time on the water do not throw a tail rotating lure much anymore unless it has at least front and rear sonics. Again, we are very opinionated and thats just my findings. TIME ON THE WATER MAN!
Edited by jdsplasher 12/11/2009 9:52 AM
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Posts: 305
| interesting discussion...please keep it going. would like to hear others chime in, too. |
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Posts: 2270
Location: SE, WI. | Beav; Someday I'd like to see that firefly in action and see what that chain does. Maybe I'll see you on Pewaukee in 2010.
By the way...the Black flaptail above sold today...thanks Charlie. |
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Posts: 11
| JD: Rattles? Hmm interesting! |
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Posts: 309
Location: Elgin IL | I like the old Cisco kid toppers with brass bushings and I think these work better because the Flaptail is attached with a ballbearing and really kicks up the water.....love it in calm water
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Location: SE, WI. | Hello dragginhook. How's that knee replacement doing???
Brian B. you have a PM. |
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Posts: 774
Location: South East Wisconsin | msky3, is that a modification to the topper? Or did you buy it like that? |
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Posts: 32886
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Smity makes a great flaptail, very well made and close to the old Snodlow.
$20 at the Tri Esox Show.
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Posts: 238
| Bill Kaiser also makes a real nice flaptail! |
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Posts: 4266
| I have modified Bucher's walk-the-dog thing that is the front section of a Top-Raider. It was such a pain to work that I put a swivel and a heavy flaptail blade on it instead. It sits nice and low in the water, but I only use one hook, a 6/0, it's only a 4" lure so they should be able to get it all in their mouth.
A Pewaukee Turd Outing sounds like fun. "Turds Only"
I'll have to visit my buddy Smitty in Milwaukee.
Are those thin or heavy blades on his?
I prefer the heavy ones by a long shot.
Edited by Beaver 1/8/2010 9:34 PM
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| Joel Wicks flaptails have quite the cult following as of late. i run his, alongside a few of Ryan Jinkersons lures, though in the rylres my flap tails are not straight flap tails like the wick or snodlow design. I like Ryans ctreepin flap tail, wobblin flap tail, and even the globe version. He also makes the subtle straight version most here are looking for, but the other varieties are cool too, for a change-up. |
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Posts: 2270
Location: SE, WI. | YA BEAV, We can check out each others turds, then go fish them. Should make some well done brats after fishing to signify the brown turds we threw for the last 3 hours...LOL Of course, you paint those flourescent neon turds, hard to cook a brat like that...
The outing should be early June for the best turd fishing. HILARIOUS!!! TURDS ONLY!
Edited by jdsplasher 1/9/2010 9:19 PM
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Posts: 4266
| Spononsored by DEPENDS!
If you're already throwing one Turd, you'll need something to catch the others. New Depends, with the Turd-catcher pouch.
Edited by Beaver 1/9/2010 9:41 PM
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Posts: 774
Location: South East Wisconsin | How do i get a turd! |
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Posts: 2270
Location: SE, WI. | Esoz-hunter; My suggestion is you go back for 2nd's tonight during dinner. Maybe a few pretzels before bed. Turds just seem to appear the next morning!!! |
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Location: Racine, Wi | LMAO!!!! |
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Posts: 774
Location: South East Wisconsin | Thanks guys! |
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