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Location: Des Moines IA | My Tuffy is 20 horses underpowered, and has a hard time getting up on plane. Does anyone have experience with the whale tail add ons? Do they actually work? Are they worth the money? |
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Posts: 1663
Location: Kodiak, AK | From what I understand, they are ideal for underpowered boats, helping get out of the hole. Won't (or shouldn't at least) do anything for your top speed or fuel economy, as it should be out of the water while on plane.
What are you calling "underpowered" by 20? Is your boat rated for 225 and you have a 200 or is it rated for 60 and you have 40? 60/40 will have more net results than 225/200 for example. The lower your hp rating, the higher the percentage of max hp 20 is. Does that make sense? Not sure if I'm saying it right.
Basically, if you're rated at 225 and you've got a 200, you may not see much improvement. But if you're rated at 60 and you have a 40, you'll see more.
Edited by esoxfly 10/16/2009 11:18 AM
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Location: Des Moines IA | It's rated @ 90, and I've got a 70, so it should help. I think it's worth the 70$. I've spent more than that on a bar tab!!!! |
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Posts: 20269
Location: oswego, il | I put one on my little princecraft and it definitely helped get my boat on plane faster. |
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Posts: 797
Location: North Central IL USA | My boat is rated for 120 and I have a 70 on it. The Hydrofoil I put on it this summer did wonders with the hole shot. Plus I can stay on plane at much lower speeds than I could without it. I lost about 1 maybe 2 MPH at the top end. Well worth the trade off far as I'm concerned! |
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Posts: 2323
Location: Stevens Point, WI | Are you running a stainless steel prop? If not, a ss prop will also help your hole shot and actually increase your speed. However, it will cost you more to upgrade this than to buy a whale tail. |
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Posts: 3508
Location: Elk River, Minnesota | Hiya,
For that same $70 you could get a lower pitched prop which will essentially do the same thing....and will not add any holes to your anti-ventilation plate, reducing any trade-in value if that is something you intend to do at any point in time in the future.
There are other things you can do to help increase hole-shot without needing a wing, besides a prop change, you can also move your motor up a hole or two, which will help keep the bow down on hole=shot, and it will also get more boat out of the water at planing speed.
If you would consider a prop change, I would suggest going with a solas Alcup 3 or Alcup 4. These props have two major aspects that a standard prop does not have: A larger exhaust opening, which means the motor can breathe easier...which increases overall HP, and with the fins being fully cupped like a steel prop, it grabs like one too....and doesn't flex anywhere near as much as a standard Aluminum prop because it has been squeeze cast, which eliminates air pockets which are common in a standard cast aluminum prop... All of this for about $90 or so.
To be honest, I don't think you are seriously underpowered, but there are some tweaks you can try and see how that might help. In some cases, moving some weight around in the boat (in your case, I would think moving it forward) would help, but I would also check the trim stop shaft and make sure that is in the lowest position possible ensuring that the motor tucks under as much as possible.
Lots of things to try, and my personal opinion of a tail is a band-aid for the problem....
Steve |
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Posts: 32951
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | VMS is correct. Mike, post what your prop numbers are please. |
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Posts: 1270
| YOu can get one that does not require any holes being drilled now. |
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Location: Ontario | You can also look in to smart tabs (made by Nauticus), I have them on my boat and they work great. |
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| This thread was a bit of a disappointment....... the name implies something else...... |
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Posts: 32951
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | This is the Boats and Motors forum...  |
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Posts: 3518
Location: north central wisconsin | Lifeisfun, could you expand on your use of smart tabs if you wouldn't mind? What is your rig, motor etc? I have been looking into the same thing for an 18.5' glass tiller underpowered with a 90 hp. While my top end is satisfactory, I have a relatively poor hole shot. I have tried a number of props, and am back to the same conclusion, needing either a Hydrofoil or tabs. Please explain how you have used yours, and what you tried before settling on them if you don't mind.
Thanks in advance!!
Edited by Reef Hawg 10/19/2009 2:04 PM
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Location: Des Moines IA | I'm running a 13.25X17 prop. Aluminum. I want to keep the top speed, so I don't really want to down size my prop, I just want to get out of the hole quicker, without dropping 300$ on a stainless steel prop. |
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Posts: 32951
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | All you'd lose going to a 15 is a couple MPH, but a 4 blade stainless would be the bomb. I'll watch for one for you at a good price. Tuffy sells quite a few 1700 models with 75 HP motors, that 70 ought to do better. I think I may have a stainless prop for a Suzi around here from Keith's rig, I'll look. |
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Posts: 3508
Location: Elk River, Minnesota | And to piggy back off steve Worrall's comment, if you go steel in a 15 pitch, you will probably not see any loss in speed, but a huge gain in hole shot because the prop won't flex anywhere like an aluminum prop.
I would still say take a look at the Solas alcup line.... performance extremely close to steel at the price of an aluminum. I keep my 13.5 x 17 as a spare. How many splines you need? If mine matches to yours, I'll let you try it... I doubt I would need it back until spring...
Steve |
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Location: Des Moines IA | I barely get up tp 30 MPH as it is, and don't want to lose any of that. By myself with no gear, and no gas I can get about 35 out of her. She's runnin about 5600 RPM with 2 guys and gear, so she's at her sweet spot RPM wise, Would a 17 pith Steel help the hole shot any? |
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Posts: 3518
Location: north central wisconsin | 17 pitch Stainless(in the same model) will impede your hole shot, as it is heavier, doeasn't flex and therefore a bit harder to get turning than the aluminum. One thing you could do is try to find a 16P Stainless prop. that is what I am running on my 90HP Tiller and I really like it(best I've found so far but haven't tried a 4 blade yet). Mine is a semi cleavered design for Yamahas and Mercury motors. The other thing is if you didn't want to spend money is to possibly get your prop vented, though I don't know if they do that to aluminum. |
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Posts: 32951
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Reef Hawg, that's backwards. Less flex means better hole shot because less energy is used by the prop and more is directed to moving water; the stainless prop holds it's shape better resulting in better performance.. The actual weight of the prop is pretty much irrelevant, rpm climb and maximum is determined by the pitch and diameter. |
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Location: Ontario | Reef Hawg - 10/19/2009 3:03 PM
Lifeisfun, could you expand on your use of smart tabs if you wouldn't mind? What is your rig, motor etc? I have been looking into the same thing for an 18.5' glass tiller underpowered with a 90 hp. While my top end is satisfactory, I have a relatively poor hole shot. I have tried a number of props, and am back to the same conclusion, needing either a Hydrofoil or tabs. Please explain how you have used yours, and what you tried before settling on them if you don't mind.
Thanks in advance!!
I have them mounted on 17' G3 boat powered by 60HP 4S Yamaha.
They improved my hole shot dramatically.
See the demos on manufactures web site. Also they have excellent customer service. There is lots of discussion and installation help on iboats boating forum.
The company owner helps to answer every question |
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Posts: 3518
Location: north central wisconsin | I can see that in a high powered or perfectly matched rig, but, in an underpowered rig, wouldn't a bit of flex in a prop with too high of a pitch, allow for it to spin faster resulting in a better hole shot than a steel prop in the same pitch? Sure seems to be the case with my big boat and my little one where the same pitch al props get me up and out quicker but less top end. Isn't there a curve of sorts depending on horesepower/transfer of power potential? I always thought the lighter props spinned easier out of the hole but flexed more on top and didn't hold their form for full speed potential. Good to know that isn't the case, but I would like to know why the higher pitch aluminums always out-rev the stainless, at least the ones we've tested..
Here's a dumb question: why does my 16P stainless have better top end, and slightly less hole shot than the same aluminum. My prop guy told me a good rule of thumb is that the same pitch alum equals about 2 less in the same stainless for my motor. He said because of weight and flex. Is it just the weight then? Wouldn't flex cause the diameter to go down a bit, making it easier to spin? Great thread, great info.
Edited by Reef Hawg 10/21/2009 6:11 PM
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Posts: 32951
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | The pitch and diameter of the stainless and aluminum may be the same, but other minor differences like design of the blades, surface area, cup, etc can cause what you describe. Generally speaking, a stainless in the same pitch, diameter, and design will give you better top end and a better hole shot. The stainless isn't really 'harder to turn', it should get the boat on plane faster and reach a better top end increasing efficiency in the process.
If the blades flex at all, the lift and forward thrust of the prop is diminished, so technically, the flex makes the motor work harder. |
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Whale Tail