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Posts: 55
Location: Arena WI | Had a few fish really make it a mess to get the lure out. Any suggestions on how to prevent this from happening? |
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| Tough one, but a quality net really helps a lot. |
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Posts: 198
| I had this problem a few times and went to a larger net, biggest they make. Seemed to help. Also sometimes it's easier to cut hooks than to try and untangle the fish and get the lure out that way. |
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Posts: 1938
Location: Black Creek, WI | Are you using a Beckman Fin Saver? I switched back to larger meshing (Frabill)and the problem improved tremendously. |
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Posts: 433
Location: Cedarburg, Wisconsin | From what I've seen, the quicker you put the fish in the net the more grief you have trying to unhook it. They spin more, thrash out of your grip more and in general rip themselves up more after the hooks tangle in the mesh. I'm not advocating fighting them till they go belly up, but putting them in too quick is not good. I try to grab them as soon as possible to keep them from spinning, but you still have to be safe about it. Fingers first, fish second. |
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Posts: 1169
Location: New Hope MN | I feel your pain man. Big pike seem to be the worst! |
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Posts: 2894
Location: Yahara River Chain | birdsnest - 10/5/2009 11:11 AM
Had a few fish really make it a mess to get the lure out. Any suggestions on how to prevent this from happening?
Quit fishing for them or rather catching them. The same reason they fight you when you hook them is the same reason they twist in the net. They just don't know they are caught and should give up. That stupidity is also great allowing us to use wood or a couple of pieces of revolving metal to hook them.
They do make tight weave nets that would allow them not to get tangled up, but the down side to those nets is that they don't go through the water very fast.
Edited by muskie! nut 10/5/2009 4:14 PM
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Posts: 313
Location: On your favorite spot | yep - need a new net bag - mine is thin mesh and sucks bad, got some awful tangles from hyper fish and hooks flying all over and i don't want that to be the reason one doesn't swim away sometime. |
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Posts: 774
Location: South East Wisconsin | Whats so bad about the Beckman Fin Saver?
S.Killips |
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Posts: 2024
| Esox-Hunter - 10/5/2009 9:33 PM
Whats so bad about the Beckman Fin Saver?
S.Killips
The small netting causes lures to tangle more frequently and worse than other nets, as mentioned above. If you own a Beckman and haven't experienced this, give it time and you will. I like my Beckman, but HATE the small mesh netting. If a fish rolls, forget about it. Just reach for the Knipex and start cutting hooks.
Someone needs to build a completely rubberized net (like those used for bass fishing: http://www.basspro.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10151_-1_1...), not this "coated" stuff that's currently out there (not just to solve the issue of tangled lures, but in general for the fish). Hopefully, Frabill or Beckman are listening.
But I digress...
Edited by esox50 10/5/2009 9:41 PM
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Posts: 618
Location: Michigan | jlong - 10/5/2009 1:13 PM
Are you using a Beckman Fin Saver? I switched back to larger meshing (Frabill)and the problem improved tremendously.
Agree 100%! |
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Posts: 4266
| Rolling fish is one of several reasons that I cut every hook that I can see as fast as I can. They can't get tangled if there aren't any hooks to tangle in the mesh. I also use a really big Frabill, and once the fish is in the bottom, I kind of cinch down on the top corners so it acts almost like a cradle. This quiets them a little while I cut the hooks, and once the hooks are cut, I cut the line and pull the lure out of the net so it's just me and the fish. No fish rolling and ripping themselves up or sending me to the ER.
Beaver |
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Posts: 1663
Location: Kodiak, AK | I've got a Fin Saver and it is a pain. I've got the Beckman for it's light weight, but I'm almost thinking of going to a Frabil just for the bag. One thing that does help me tremendously is fishing barbless hooks. The fish will usually spit the hook in the bag. I look down and the bait is free. The big bag helps, but I'd still like a bigger mesh and may just switch after this season. |
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| If you give them a couple extra solid hook sets as they near the boat you can "stun or daze" even the largest muskie...really makes the unhooking in the net easier. Also makes the netting easier as well...;) 
Edited by BenR 10/5/2009 11:19 PM
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Posts: 2361
| BenR - 10/5/2009 11:14 PM
If you give them a couple extra solid hook sets as they near the boat you can "stun or daze" even the largest muskie...really makes the unhooking in the net easier. Also makes the netting easier as well...;) ;)
That sounds like the ticket. And lets hope those electing this method, have excellent reflexes! |
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Location: Grand Rapids, MI | I see rolling a lot more when someone less expreienced is netting regardless of net brand. If you lift on the fish at all w/ the net their first reaction seems to be to roll. I usually see this happen when someone reaches too far w/ the net then pulls the fish back to the boat. The other time seems to be if the fish gets hung high in the bag and their head is lifted out of the water as the net is resting on the side of the boat. No lifting and head under water makes a big difference in how calm that fish will remain while in the net. |
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Posts: 1938
Location: Black Creek, WI | Will makes a good point regarding how well the fish is put in the bag. Experience is always a plus. Regardless of your experience or skill level, I've found that a stiffer bag material (heavily coated or rubber) and larger loops/meshing are major benefits for avoiding a tightly wound lure in the netting.... no matter how well you bag 'em.
The smaller mesh of the Fin Saver bag sure made it easier to "inflate the bag" for good fish entry.... but the added resistance or drag in the water made it almost impossible to make big position changes or to execute the quick-scoop sometimes needed to keep the fish going deep into the bag and avoiding a tangled lure high in the net.
These "issues" were significant enough to lead me back to Frabill after many years of loyalty to Beckman. |
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| jlong and esox50 are right on the money on this one. The problem of the Fin Saver netting is compounded by the large hooks so common on today's baits - 6/0 and 7/0 hooks have a lot of space to grab netting and the smaller mesh of the Fin Saver gives the hooks lots of opportunity to grab. A wide open mesh, like on the Frabill nets, will still get grabbed by the big hooks but nowhere nearly as bad as Fin Saver mesh.
Fin Saver mesh is great in theory, but in practicality isn't that great for a fish when you have to spend more time untangling the fish, thus increasing stress and removing slime.
Don't get me wrong. Beckman makes a great net. Just don't buy the Fin Saver mesh and you and your muskies will be much happier in the long term. |
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Posts: 1938
Location: Black Creek, WI | Guest - 10/6/2009 8:28 AM
Don't get me wrong. Beckman makes a great net. Just don't buy the Fin Saver mesh and you and your muskies will be much happier in the long term.
Yes. I agree. |
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| I would consider upgrading to a Frabill Big Kahuna. I know its huge and hard to store but if you like to see fish go in the net and not roll and get all hung up in the net, this is the ticket. The bigger loops in the net and IMHO reduces the thrashing and rolling becuase the lure doesn't get caught up in the net as much as the other brand with the smaller loops. If it does, it makes it much faster to get the lure and fish disconnected from the net. The very deep bag makes it much easier to pen the fish penned up without lifting the fish out of the water as Will suggested above. |
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Posts: 785
| Big Kahuna!! I got one just so I wasn't stuffing upper 40's and 50's in my little beckman I had. Since owning it though I haven't had a single fish get badly tangled in it... not one. It's coated mesh and has a loose weave plus its just plain huge all of which more or less prevent tangling. If you can make the space and can afford it that's what I'd do. Just a side note if anyone uses the non coated meshing your pretty much asking for the fish to tangle you up. When I just started and didn't know any better I used one of those and it was awful... for me and the fish... lessons learned lol.
In the day not so much but at night the fish seem to just thrash on the surface and not make much for runs so I usually end up netting them very green. With the big K I still haven't had issues with tangling and looking at pictures the fish don't even seem to chew there fins up hardly at all. With my smaller net greener fish split there fins bad.
Edited by musky-skunk 10/6/2009 11:14 AM
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| Will hit the nail on the head here.
To aviod crazy amounts of rolling, get a big mesh, coated net. I use the Frabill Big Kahuna, which in my opinion is the best net on the market by far.
Also, experience in netting will also come into play. If you drop the bag to early or have a poor angle on the fish when netting it, the fish will do the death roll for sure.
Get the Frabill Big Kahuna, and when netting fish, hold the bottom of the bag until the fish is ready to be scooped up. |
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Posts: 774
Location: South East Wisconsin | I have the Beckman Mag XD Fin Saver and I haven't had any problems. I guess time will tell.
S.Killips |
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Posts: 1663
Location: Kodiak, AK | Is the Frabill Big Game manageable by someone fishing alone? |
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Location: Grand Rapids, MI | esoxfly - 10/7/2009 10:37 AM Is the Frabill Big Game manageable by someone fishing alone? I've netted fish with a friends net w/ one hand no problem. You could also add the Frabill net (BigGame or Kahuna) to your current Beckman hoop. |
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Posts: 1663
Location: Kodiak, AK | Yeah, I was thinking about doing that too. |
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Posts: 1938
Location: Black Creek, WI | Frabill bag on a Beckman hoop works fine.
I have used friend's Frabil Big Game hoops with Kahuna bags as well. I like this combo as I do not like the huge hoop of the Kahuna.
At any rate... I feel the tangled lure issue is simply a loop size and stiffness issue of the netting, and as long as you avoid the fin saver netting... you should be fine. |
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Posts: 462
Location: Antioch, IL | Easy solution: Don't net them unless you have to. If we don't intend on taking photos and the fish is hooked in a way that the lure is easily accessable we will just shake them off boatside. Obviously be safe about it (correct tools, don't hold the leader,...)
++ Pike are not allowed in the net. ++ |
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Posts: 1296
Location: WI | I've had about 45 muskies in my Beckman and haven't had much of a problem with tangling. I see more split fins in the bigger meshed Frabil nets, which is why I will never buy one.
Maybe you guys are catching too small of fish? Those little ones sure like to dance around in the net. |
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Posts: 203
| never had a problem with getting lures out of my beckman...and i am catching too small of fish.. hehe |
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Posts: 32935
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | The Frabill doesn't split fins any worse than any other net and is better than many, and the large mesh makes for easier lure extraction. The large, coated mesh is very fish friendly. |
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Location: The Yahara Chain | esoxfly - 10/7/2009 9:37 AM
Is the Frabill Big Game manageable by someone fishing alone?
Yes it is. I've netted piles of fish in mine while fishing solo. |
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Posts: 1663
Location: Kodiak, AK | Sweet. Thanks Troy. |
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Posts: 1663
Location: Kodiak, AK | I about threw my Beckman in the lake tonight. Heavy seas, and a deep hooked 44...one hook deep in the mouth, and one tangled to no end in the friggin net!!! I had to cut the hook out of the net before I could mess with the fish. Even with barbless hooks, it was so tangled in the net it wasn't coming out. All went well, but had it been 75* water, and I not had cutter, the fish could've died. It was rididculous because of that bag. I'm done with it. |
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Posts: 774
Location: South East Wisconsin | Do you have an old Beckman or a new one? Im just wondering cause im not experiencing the problems some are talking about.
S.Killips |
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| I use a frabill big game, but I have friends that use a beckman. I actually really like the beckman and have never had any issues in the times I've used it. Fish get tangled in the frabills as well. The key is to act fast. Cut hooks just to untangle the net if you have to. |
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Posts: 774
Location: South East Wisconsin | "I actually really like the beckman and have never had any issues in the times I've used it."
I hear ya me to! I know mine is pretty old so maybe the netting is not the same as the ones guys are having trouble with.
S.Killips |
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| I've used both the old style and the new style beckman while in friends boats. Maybe I am missing something here too, but I have not noticed any problems. My brother had an old style frabill that gave me a headache, but he got rid of that one at least.
Edited by Baby Mallard 10/8/2009 11:08 PM
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Posts: 1663
Location: Kodiak, AK | I bought my Beckman about a year ago. Last night the waves were up pretty badly and I was drifting about 1 mph, so as I got the fish in the net and had her over the side of the boat, she went to the bottom of the bag and actually go pulled underneath the boat. So as I pulled the bag out from underneath the boat, she kicked and it was done. The free hook was so badly tangled in the net I couldn't get it untangled because the tiny holes in the net it was just impossible. I did cut the hook right away, but it still frustrated me that the net was was so tightly tangled. You couldn't even see the hook because it had so much net bag wrapped around it. I'm sure all bags tangle, but I can't help but think that larger mesh would be easier to work with and not tangle with one roll. |
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Posts: 774
Location: South East Wisconsin | Okay I gotcha now. My Beckman is pretty old and my bag has big open mesh with some little mesh squares.
S.Killips |
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Posts: 3518
Location: north central wisconsin | Esox Hunter, the older Beckman(pre Lindy) bags had a much larger weave to the threads. I was really happy with all of my Beckmans(Beckmen..?..) through the 90's, until a couple years ago when I got a new bag for a 10 year old Fin Saver. The first fish we netted with that bag nearly swam through the net, breaking several threads on its way out. My old bags' coating had worn away over the years, and had maybe 3 or 4 broken 'squares' through cutting and hooking damage over a decade. Lindy(Ted Takasaki) was very good about replacing my bag and listening to my issue. However, my new bag also has the same thin strands compared to the old ones, though has remained stout. I will forward this thread to Ted, as I am sure they'd like to hear about any complaints. Luckily these complaints have been about Beckman and not Frabill, or they would have been deleted before I had a chance to copy them. That said, it was never the fin saver bag style causing the issue for me, as I never had the tangly mess and broken strands with the old bag with thick threads. That also said, I still prefer the ease of use of the Beckman over the larger overly cumbersome Frabil nets, which also means something.
Edited by Reef Hawg 10/10/2009 11:49 PM
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Posts: 285
Location: NE Wisconsin | I own and have used both the Frabil and the Beckman nets. I fish alone, 80+ % of the time. I have a large Beckman in my boat. Enough said. As far as broken "squares", I carry plastic wire ties in my boat, for a quick fix. I cut a lot of hooks, so occasionally the broken "squares" are my fault. As stated earlier, if the bait gets hooked "high" in the net, I find more of a tendency to have rolling problems. When this happens, immediately get the Knipex cutter. First cut the hook from the bait, to separate the bait from the fish, then cut the hook from the fish. Separating the the hook from the lure first, usually solves the tangle problems, then you can go about separating the hook from the fish. |
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Posts: 512
| esoxfly - 10/7/2009 9:37 AM
Is the Frabill Big Game manageable by someone fishing alone?
i had this net, and my nephew got a 51 this summer, and it barely fit. also made a hole in the net bag. I had been looking into getting a kahuna for a few years, was worried it was too big and pricey, but i had no choice since we were on a trip up north. Also didnt want to experience almost losing a giant again!!
turns out it isnt that much of a problem as far as size, just lay it on the deck for the most part.. Have yet to net a fish by myself, dont think it will be a problem..
Dave |
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| Let us know how it goes when you net one by yourself with that beast. My buddy who guides tells me he hates his big kahuna when fishing alone. He said he lost a 53+ because of it this year. BTW, I have netted numerous fish over 50 with a big game frabill without any problems. Net is not too small, I could get a 60 incher in there.  If you had one of those older style ones I could see how you could call it small or have problems.
Edited by Baby Mallard 10/10/2009 5:34 PM
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Posts: 1663
Location: Kodiak, AK | Yeah, I know guys that have had 50's in a Big Game. I'm not going to gamble with the Kahuna, coolness points or not. It's just too big for me to want to mess with by myself. I figure too big a net can cause just as many problems as too small a net when fishing alone. Fishing with someone, then go as big as possible, but alone, too much net can get cumbersome and border on clumsy. |
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Posts: 512
| Baby Mallard - 10/10/2009 5:30 PM
Let us know how it goes when you net one by yourself with that beast. My buddy who guides tells me he hates his big kahuna when fishing alone. He said he lost a 53+ because of it this year. BTW, I have netted numerous fish over 50 with a big game frabill without any problems. Net is not too small, I could get a 60 incher in there. If you had one of those older style ones I could see how you could call it small or have problems.
Ya it could be a handful, we will see. but the net i had did have a big net bag, but the hoop wasnt that big.. think it was a big game, (8420 i think?)
and how did he know it was 53 if it got away?? |
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| He has caught enough fish around 53" to be able to guesstimate at the fish he lost. He had the fish up to the boat three times and got a good look at it.
Edited by Baby Mallard 10/12/2009 6:06 PM
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Fish Rolling in the net