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Posts: 230
| OK,
So i bought some 130 and 200 pound mono leader material, Berkley Big Game, to make some leaders out of. I was thinking of making them with a knot to hold the swivel and snap on, and then crimp the tag ends. I wanted to use a Canoe Man loop knot, but the problem with this knot is that the tag end is left perpendicular to the main line when the knot is finished. Therefore, I wouldn't be able to add a crimp. I was also thinking of using a Uni-knot, but uni's are supposed to slip down tight when fighting a fish-which is another problem. So, I pose a question to you guys, how exactly do you make your leaders?
Thanks! |
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Posts: 189
Location: Barrington, Il | I would just crimp or knot. No reason to do both if done right. |
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Location: Latitude 41.3016 Longitude 88.6160 | LOOK at this http://www.ofncommunity.com/forums/index.php?automodule=blog&blogid... |
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Posts: 230
| I will most likely go with the knot because i don't have all the correct crimping supplies...yet.
Pikemaster- Thanks for that link! Thats exactly what i need.
Is it overkill to use 200lb test? I only bought the 200 to make leaders for chucking pounders and 2lbers, assuming I can throw them. I don't want to lose a 30 dollar lure because my leader broke. |
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Location: Latitude 41.3016 Longitude 88.6160 | If U want to use a knot then use this one http://www.fishing-khaolak.com/knots/centauri.html CENTAURI KNOT very easy to tie 130lb F/C plus line. 130 is fine 150 for pounders. I think 100# is to light but alot of musky guys use it, and 200 is to big.
Edited by PIKEMASTER 7/30/2009 12:40 PM
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Posts: 230
| OK, maybe i will return the 200 and get the 150. I will have to see how the 150 works. I believe that the 100 is a little light too, but i like the 130 a lot. Its fairly limp, and doesn't show up too much in water, even for mono. Haven't tried fluorocarbon yet though. |
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Posts: 106
Location: On Lake St Clair Michigan | The Next Bite guys have a nice short video about musky leaders and they do not use a crimp. 120lb has worked for me! |
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Posts: 106
Location: On Lake St Clair Michigan | Oh and I also leave the Tag end hang out where it is tied into the mainline. This acts a weed hook and it keeps them off the lure.
Another tip Pete M. |
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Posts: 12
| I've been using a nail knot, which holds beautifully and keeps the tag end parallel to the main line. With heavy fluoro, you'll want a tool to tie it consistently. |
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Posts: 646
Location: In a shack in the woods | I have been thinking about albright knotting a 3 foot piece of flouro directly to my line with a staylock snap palomar knotted on the lure end. Has anyone tried this? I think it would be better for invisibility and if a fish chews up a section I could just cut it off and retie the snap. |
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Posts: 572
| Stainless steel thimbles......interesting. Looks like a good idea. What size? How much are they? Where can I find them? I saw some at Lowe's, but they were zinc coated. |
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Posts: 12
| Bob, are you thinking about casting with this setup, or just trolling? The Albright is not going to come out of the guides smoothly on a cast, since that big fat tag will be hitting every guide on the way out. Even the best knot in 130# fluoro is going to be bulky and clunk around... |
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Posts: 646
Location: In a shack in the woods | I was hoping to cast but wanted to know how it would work. I was thinking it would be safer on my guides and a more natural aproach. I'm going to have to play around with it a bit. I might only have to put a foot of flouro on it. |
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Posts: 12
| If you're determined to tie directly to a fluoro leader, you may want to think about something a little more like big game fishermen use, starting with tying a Bimini twist in your braid. Since we primarily use 130-150# fluoro for its abrasion resistance, not its breaking strength, you can choose the knot you use to attach the leader for its ability to flow through the guides rather than brute knot strength.
If you're using 80# braid and 130# leader, your leader knot only needs to test at 80 pounds to maintain the full strength of your rig--that's only about 60% of the strength of the leader. By putting the Bimini in your main line, you are effectively creating a line of double the strength of the main line that is fed into the knot, so even a relatively poor knot should test higher than the single main line. The Bimini will flow through the guides without incident, will give you another indicator of when your leader is approaching, and can be tied so that you have a double long enough to retie several times. All that's left is to find a knot to join the leader that holds securely enough not to drop below 80 pounds and will flow through the guides with minimal difficulty. |
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Posts: 12
| Two other possibilities strike me: the Slim Beauty knot, tied with the braid doubled and finished with alternating hitches on the main line, or--and this is only based on a couple of preliminary tests--nail knotting (15-20 turns) the braid to the leader much like attaching a leader butt to a fly line. In order to make the nail knot work, however, you must use a lighter to create a bulb on the end of the leader so that the braid can't slip over it under pressure.
The latter would end up fishing almost like a knotless connection, which--using hollow super braid--is probably the ultimate solution; it's the way saltwater guys create wind-on leaders and topshots. |
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| Testing shows that knots are weaker than a properly crimped connection!
Taken from http://www.sportfishingmag.com/article.jsp?ID=6037
"Crimps still out tested knots, especially on heavier monofilament. Using the 130-pound Diamond Line (that actually broke at 260 pounds) in a dry test, our best knot -- the doubled clinch knot -- broke at 150 pounds for a 40-percent loss of strength. Other knots tested even lower, down to 85 pounds for a three-turn uniknot, a mere 30 percent of the potential breaking strength."
Has anyone here done any tests comparing knots vs crimps?
According to the link, if one used a knot as well as a crimp together, then the connection would break first at the weakest link, i.e. the knot!
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Posts: 12
| Interesting article, NQ. While the article makes clear that crimps can be potentially superior to knots, it also emphasizes that crimps not made exactly right for the sleeve and the specific line can fail well below the strength of the line. It seems that the only way to guarantee perfect crimps is to use a very expensive swaging tool that can be precisely calibrated to crimp the combination of line and sleeve consistently. The author doesn't mention how many knots they tried, but I'd be extremely surprised if nothing tests better than 40%. Even so, the leader need only break at a higher strength than the main line--the extra pound test is, at least in my opinion, for abrasion resistance. |
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Posts: 618
Location: Seymour, WI | I wanted to start tying my own flouro leaders, but when I shopped for flouro at Rollies it was ~ $50 for a spool, so I decided to stick with steel.
What is the best brand of 130lb flouro for the money and how much is it for a spool?
Thanks,
Grass |
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Posts: 443
Location: Duluth, MN | Do a search on Ebay for Hi Seas Flurocarbon. 25yards, 130lb test for $30. |
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Leaders-How do you guys make 'em?