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Location: Northern Wisconsin | This week i missed a couple fish due to my poor hook sets. What are some tips for hooksets? my problem was not setting the hooks very hard. DO you want to set them hard or what?? What about figure 8 fish? how hard and how do you set the hook on them??
i had two fish hit on the 8 and start fighting for several seconds only to come off.
any tips on setting the hook would help.
Thanks |
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Posts: 550
Location: So. Illinois | Good question, I would like to see thoughts from others as well. When casting, I have always tried to give a good solid hookset if I thought I had a strike. Problem is, I think I may have been setting the hooks too hard with too big or a sweep on occasion and actually pulled the hooks out of the fishes mouth. I now try a moderate hookset with the intention of applying pressure to the fish to keep the line tight. If I have a softer rod that has give, My hooksets will be a little firmer and with a bit more sweep. IF I am fishing with a stout rod with little give, I set the hooks with a sharp, short sweep fof the rodtip. I find that I am hooking up more often and loosing fewer fish. On figure 8's, I try to set the hook into th fish byu pulling the rodtip toward the tail fo the fish, then its a matter of keeping the line tight while feeding a little line if needed. Not sure that I will ever get it right, but for me it comes down to staying relaxed, not getting over excited and pratice.... |
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Posts: 646
Location: In a shack in the woods | I agree with chief. The only thing I would add is that keep your hooks as sharp as possible. I keep a sharpener in a pouch on my tackle box
Edited by bassinbob84 6/13/2009 4:58 PM
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| In my opinion you try and set the hooks as hard as you can at the time and position you're in and then take control of the battle. Rod tip low and get the fish in the net as soon as possible. I have seen it too many times someone playing a fish to long and the fish gets off. Fig 8's fish hits and I set the hooks in the same direction as I'm moving the bait. I try and drag the fish around if possible.
My opinion.
Chris |
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Posts: 203
Location: Minnesota | Always sharpen your hooks before you put the lure on... and check it frequently... no harm in re-sharpening it...
hook files are cheap... and very handy... learned my lesson big time last year... lost 5 fishes cuz the hooks were dull... they would just come out even after a moderate to hard hookset... from that point on, no lures goes on without being sharpened... takes a minute or two to do it... |
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Posts: 282
Location: north west wisconsin | sharp hooks help alot!! I try to think about what type of lure I have on too, a soft wood lure like pine i tend to set the hook a little harder cause the teeth can bury into it, and not allow the lure to move in the fishes mouth, with plastic or rubber on the other hand i feel you don't need to set the hook quite as hard as the lure will move fairly easy, also with the no stretch lines I don't have a big sweeping hookset I generally move the rod tip a foot or two
, I'm sure opinions vary on this subject but that's my 2 cents
Tony
Edited by floydss 6/13/2009 10:27 PM
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | Ram 'em home. |
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Posts: 158
Location: Burlington, WI | The saying goes "either break their jaw or break your line". Meaning set the hooks as hard as you can. I think a good hard hookset is the way to go, but once you snapped that hookset don't continue to pull rather fight the fish. I think I've lost some fish by "fighting the fish too hard" and pulling the hooks out. Hope this makes sense. |
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Posts: 3867
| I slam the hooks home as hard as possible, and then I reel down and hit her again.
Triple ditto on sharp hooks. Honestly, I don't hit the water without every point on every hook on every bait as sharp as I can make it. After using the file, paint freshly exposed metal with a perm marker to prevent corrosion while in the box.
Make sure your drag setting is PERFECT and then you can't "fish too hard". This is especially important for boatside strikes at night. If you use older Ambassadeur 5000 or 6000 series reels you should replace the original crappy drag washers with Smooothies. Loosen the drag when not fishing and reset the drag on each reel when you hit the water.
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Posts: 159
Location: Stevens Point, WI | On the figure 8 fish i've started having way more success slamming backwards when the fish strikes. I basically try to snag the musky on the inside of the mouth. I got so sick of pulling the bait out of their mouths when they are nipping at it that i started turning it backwards on them when they hit and it's done good things for me. And i try to break their neck with it, too! No such thing as too hard in that game, i think. I'm on free spool on a figure 8 and try to clamp it down with my thumb when they hit- it's well worth a raw thumb! |
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Posts: 267
Location: Ft. Wayne, Indiana | Drag cranked down as tight as it goes and a quick hard snap, setting the hook multiple times will just rip the hooks out of their mouth in my opinion. One good solid hookset is all that is needed. |
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Posts: 392
Location: lake x...where the hell is it? | i set the hook as hard as i can on everything. thats why they call me LIP RIPPER!!! |
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Posts: 139
| I like to hit it hard as possible, and as far as the fig 8 still trying to hit it back into the fish. Sometimes it can happen so fast its hard to re-act! |
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| Setting the hooks as hard as possible is NOT the best option in my opinion.
A quick SNAP and keep your rod down is all you need. Drag cranked down, quick snap, and start cranking. If it is a big fish, go into free spool when they want to run or make crazy head shakes. It is not over 45 inches, just crank'em in. |
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| I think something that gets overlooked is your rod and body position before the hook set. No matter how hard you set if your rod isn't pointed at your lure you won't get the full effect of the hookset. I always try to keep my rod tip pointed in the direction of my lure and try to keep my feet parallel. Joe Bucher had an article in MH a few years ago about positioning for the hookset. |
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Posts: 136
Location: Chicago | I try not to over analyze my hooksets super sharp hooks and and a powerful hookset hopefully does the job. If I have a ton of line out possibly ram it home a second time but rarely. As for figure eights pulled some baits out of fishes mouth as well even after I felt pressure so I always rip it back the opposite direction if I get the chance. Fish get off its part of the game all we can do is be aware and be sharp cuz missed oppurtunities always suck. |
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| I think you have to also take into consideration what type of bait you are using.
I too tightne the drag downto nothing and ram the hooks home when fishng big baits with big hooks. I subsrcibe to the theory that you have one good shot to drive them home on the initial set, so set it like you want to break your rod.
However, when fishing smaller baits with smaller hooks, like twitch baits, small suiks, and other cranks, I take a different approach. All I want to do is slide the wire hooks into the soft fleshy stuff sround the fishes face. I set my drag about half way and sweep the hooks in the set...I prefer to feel the drag slip on the hookset. This prevents me from ripping the smaller hooks right through the fleshy stuff....with these baits the gap is not wide enough to drive them through the mouth, too hard of a set with no give will tear them right through the face of the fish. |
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Posts: 3867
| I guess I should mention that I set the hook a second time because I'm often using wood baits like suicks. Ever set the hook but the fish drops off after a head shake or two and then you reel in the lure to find teeth stuck in the wood? Again, my drag is set just right and I count on my drag washers. I never thumb the spool because I never need to. I don't ever screw around with the drag setting while playing a fish.
I don't boat the numbers or size of many who responded above. But I still think that proper drag setting, with high quality drag washers, can be counted on for managing a fish at any point during the retrieve. And sharpen those hooks. |
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Posts: 1169
Location: New Hope MN | I am guessing you are not holding the spool down with your thumb when they hit on the figure 8. I have seen at least a dozen fish lost this way. A short line with too tight of drag equals a lost fish. Use your thumb as the drag when they are that close to the boat. |
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Posts: 706
Location: Richland Center, WI. | I was always told to set the hooks so hard that your hat falls off!!!!
Ken |
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Posts: 4
| I've found that if you make your partner on the front of the boat almost fall out, then you've "set the hook" hard enough. That's also a good way to let them know it's time to get the net. |
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| 1 thing is sure,never set the hooks 2 times even if the baits is made out of wood,rock,plastic,bread.
tooth will never ruin a good hookset wood or not.the key is just to make sure your hooks are sharp enough |
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| I don't know who taught you guys to set the hook so hard, but that will cause you to lose ALOT of fish. A quick snap, nothing fancy, nothing to crazy. Tight drag and SNAP it quickly. Full body hook sets are not a good thing to practice. |
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Posts: 311
Location: Ontario | I can never remember what I did when a fish hit. I just try to keep the line tight and get the fish going my way and under the water. Dick Pearson sets the hook on a bunch of fish (some big) in Muskies On The Shield and most of them he's just lifting and reeling. No giant wind up or jerking a bunch of times. Sharp hooks and no slack will keep any fish hooked on anything, IMO. We'll catch 350-500 lakers on mono between jiggin thru the ice and longlining in the spring and lose probably one out of every thirty. 60 to 200 feet away on spongy mono, they have a big, hard mouth with some nasty teeth too. The board sets the hook even when the lure's a mile back. And we commonly troll 1.3 to 1.8 mph..crawling along. You swing on a muskie burning a bucktail with 25 feet of 100lb test out and super sharp 7/0 trebles, you've got a pretty good shot at burrying the hooks solidly, IMO. Biggest thing I think is never letting any kind of slack into the line and keeping the fish's mouth under the water as best you can. I had a newbie in my boat who had a thirty pounder completely swallow a TopRaider last Labour Day. He did a little wee hookset with his rod pointing almost straight up, let a big bow of slack into the line when the fish jumped, and the lure popped out from the depths of the fish's throat like it had no hooks and was covered in teflon. I would have taken one out of six barbs in that fish with a good hookset and keeping her head down with a tight line, on the end of my rod 
Edited by JBush 6/15/2009 8:15 PM
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Posts: 692
Location: Pelican Rapids, MN | The biggest mistake I see my clients do when setting an 8 fish is that they set the hook up. Even when they set back into the fish, they set up and back. I pride myself on the "Art of the 8". it takes a lot of practice to nail it down.
Fish follows in, rod tip pointed at surface of water, starts a sweeping "L" as far out as possible, wide turns with sped up straight away, fish hits, set back and low with a hard snap, and keep tension on the fish with your rod tip kept low. When you set boatside, the upward set is going to cause that fish to either come out of the water or burst the surface in a vertical head shake conflicting with the upward arc in the rod. Thus causing a the lure to be pulled out. Low and abrupt drives the hooks home. I don't use drag. All my reels are on lock... Except topwater which has a slight give. My thumb is my drag 90% of the time. I feel like I can control the fight better, without a chance of mechanical error... Especially boatside. |
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Posts: 720
| Hey all,
This is a debate I have with my friends every year. When I started out fishing I like all of you used mono. My drag was pinned down all the way. Once braid made it in my boat I lost a ton of fish. I decided to back off the drag ever so little. My hook ups became caught fish.
My thoughts ran along this line. With the no stretch line I feel that on marginially hooked fish you were pulling the hooks out. Right or wrong sharp hooks and a forgiving drag help me a ton. |
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Posts: 311
Location: Ontario | Gues that's what I try to do do too Jerry..hit them low and keep them low. Good explanation. Reel the whole time too. Wish I got my buddy on tape losing that nice one last season..so many errors, but he learned on the job. Rod tip high almost begged the fish to jump, and that created a lot of slack when he kinda sat there watching the fish come up and throw a big bow into his line. I think controling a huge patch of your fishing line is yet another reason long rods are so good. West Coast salmon guys don't use 7'6 rods to contol the hardest fighting fish in fresh water that run 30 to 60lbs for a reason. The rods are all 10'+ to manage those jumps and huge powerful runs. A muskie fights like a bluegill compared to a big salmon. Long rods really allow you to dictate what goes on better, IMO. |
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| if you pay 400$ + for your reel and you still dont trust your drag you better get one at the dollar store  |
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Posts: 227
Location: New Brighton, MN | When a fish hits my lure, I black out.
Sorry, not much help.
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Posts: 8781
| I prefer setting the hook to not setting the hook...
As others have mentioned, I try to avoid setting the hook straight up, because it leaves you with nowhere to go. You've got slack line, the fish's head is up out of the water, you can't put pressure on the fish because your rod is up in the air... All you can do is reel down as fast as you can while dropping your rod tip and hope that you haven't given that fish enough slack line and time to throw the bait right back at you.
I like to keep the rod tip low, pointed at the fish, and set the hook to the side using my hips and shoulders, so I can maintain some control with the rod. Ideally the fish will hit on the outside turn and you can set the hook away from the fish, but that doesn't always happen... Another thing I try to avoid if possible is setting the hook across my body. Just like setting the hook straight up, it leaves you nowhere to go.
On drag settings: I used to crank my drag down as tight as it would go. That's not what a drag is for, is it?
Edited by esoxaddict 6/16/2009 10:25 AM
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Posts: 580
| Going against the grain here, I am a bigger believer in a "quick hookset" rather than a "hard hookset". I think we give ourselves a bit too much credit for actually "burying" the hook. The majority of fish that actually get hooked will have set the hook on themselves when then strike the bait. Hitting an already hooked fish really hard doesn't do much other than potentially widening the gaps of the holes that were created when the fish was hooked, potentially making it easier for the fish to throw the bait. Also, the act of rearing back for a heavy hookset can potentially create momentary slack line depending on how it is done. (Right before you rear back, and immediately after the hookset depending on how the fish is moving).
With some baits, I can agree that a hard hookset is not a bad idea, but overall I agree with the guest above, that a quick snap to immediately gain pressure and eliminate slack is the best way to keep a fish hooked up for the duration of the fight... |
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Posts: 8781
| Matt, that's a good point about fish setting the hook themselves. It seems to me that smaller fish do this almost every time. They come up, slash at the bait, and turn off at warp speed. All you really need to do is pop them a bit and keep pressure on them. Big fish are another story, though. I've lost a few bigger fish that came up behind the bait, ate it, and just kept coming right at me. Never quite figured out what to do in that situation, especially when they're coming in fast. |
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Location: Northern Wisconsin | ok thanks for the answers.
i am still confused on how one came off. it hit on the 8 and started fighting right away and swam directly away from the boat. by that time i was sure it was hooked. I dont remember if i really gave a hook set, i think i assumed it hooked itself. it pulled HARD and even striped drag with the drag very tight. then it went to the surface and trashed and the hooks came off. it was on for about 3-4 seconds so i wonder if it was just poorly hooked?? |
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Posts: 267
Location: Ft. Wayne, Indiana | My guess is that the hooks got ripped out of its mouth, a fig 8 fish requires free spool. The drag won't always work, that's why I use free spool. |
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Posts: 2015
| Get enough fish to eat in the 8 and you will have ALOT of fish come unbuttoned in the first 4 seconds..... sometimes there is nothing you can do |
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| I'll agree with "guest" here but I can imagine who "guest" is and Matt D...I think we give ourselves way to much credit for the amount of pressure / force even a "superman" type hookset really is...personally I think a steady sweeping action of the rod to the side, never up, and constant reeling will get the job done..imo if you set super hard and fast and either stopped reeling or slowed down that momentary amount of slack you might have when you bring the rod tip back to the fish is where they will get off...
I don't tend to lose many anymore ...sweep the rod, keep constant pressure and the fish will more than likely do the setting for you as imo there is a lot more force on their end than ours with hour long 8'+ foot rods...everyone has probably seen or heard of a guy holding a lure 20 feet away and having another "set hard"..not as much force as we might think....
figure 8 sets should be back and to one side hard but again never letting slack develop... |
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Location: Sun Prairie, WI | Brad, how do you have your drag set? |
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Posts: 169
Location: Houlton, WI | ive learned from reading to always keep your feet square as if you were gonna set the hook. Also point your rod tip at the lure so you can set the hook on short notice |
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Posts: 646
Location: In a shack in the woods | how can you keep your feet square and run the trolling motor. I just don't understand that. It's a good theory though.
Edited by bassinbob84 6/18/2009 6:16 PM
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Posts: 90
Location: Ohio | Juhas - 6/13/2009 5:58 PM In my opinion you try and set the hooks as hard as you can at the time and position you're in and then take control of the battle. Rod tip low and get the fish in the net as soon as possible. I have seen it too many times someone playing a fish to long and the fish gets off. Fig 8's fish hits and I set the hooks in the same direction as I'm moving the bait. I try and drag the fish around if possible. My opinion. Chris Are you supposed to fight the fish with the Rod Tip pointing down ? and if so why ? does this keep the fish from jumping and spitting the hooks ? |
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| Bob Turgeon gave a Wednesday night talk at Thorne Bros. He made an excellent point on how and why he holds the rod and its advantages with the hookset. I think they have the video somewhere on their site.
Not only did Bod discuss the hookset issue but many other very specific details that will help put big fish in the boat when that moment of truth comes about.
I strongly recommend checking it out if you think you have a wimmpy hookset.
Bob did a great job and I am planning on implementing changes to some of my ways.
Good Luck
Steve |
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Posts: 416
Location: Madtown, WI | mnmusky101, wouldn't it make more sense to have your feet off set? I have much better balance with my right foot slightly further back than my left.
I'm of the opinion that you don't need a superman hook set to impale hooks as long as your hooks are sharp. I can't even pick up a lure without getting pricked, the majority of the time the fish will set the hook on themselves. The quicker you pick up slack line the better chance you have of boating the fish. I don't think I could ever make myself do a second hookset. There have been a lot fish that I have caught that are just barely hooked, a second hook set would definitely send the bait flying directly towards my head. Sucker fishing is another story, I'll definitely set the hook twice if I didn't have much confidence in the first. |
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Posts: 716
| Hey Sorgy thanks for the nice compliments, if you want to look at this or any of seminar videos they are on the Thorne Bros site under message board then seminars.
Bob T |
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Location: Latitude 41.3016 Longitude 88.6160 | I see so many guys do a BABE RUTH hook set and as soon as the rod tip goes down goes down a little the fish is gone, why because they did not reel in the SLACK LINE !!! SET THE HOOK AND REEL IN SLACK LINE AT THE SAME TIME !!!! I will set the hook hard only on soft plastics, but reel as fast as you can to get the slack line on the reel. Hope this helps. |
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Posts: 90
Location: Ohio | Why keep the Rod Tip low when fighting or Reeling in a Muskie ? |
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Posts: 552
Location: WI | I learned the hard way last year that keeping the tip low is a must. a thrashing head above water throws hooks a whole lot easier than one below water. I had the rod in the water w/ in a foot of the cork to keep one from jumping boatside the other night. |
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Posts: 3867
| Man, I'll go down swinging on this one......
You don't need to thumb the spool if your drag is set correctly. I've never lost a boatside fish using just my drag. Actually, I almost never lose a fish that I hook, period.
* Your drag can't be set correctly if you've already damaged the washer system by cranking it down too tight. This is because if you flatten the concave washers found in many reels the drag is shot until you replace those two washers.
* If you get oil in the washers the drag is shot until you TOTALLY clean it.
* If you have an older Abu 5000 or 6000 series reels the drag system is crap right out of the box.
* Lighten the drag on every rod as you are leaving the lake. Reset (tighten) each drag as you once again hit the water.
Most people don't have the drag set at an optimal tension because they don't know what they are doing. I suspect that anyone who has upgraded the stock reel washers with Smooothies will agree that Smooothies are exceptionally effective and durable.
Thumbs down on the thumbs. |
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| I agree w/ Ranger...use your drag correctly and you won't lose fish..
I have upgraded my Morrums to smoothies..the rest of my reels like Trinidads/TE's/Penns all have great drags in them...set them so it takes a good pull from your hand to pull out line and you will be set imo...thumbing the spool to me could lead to too many things going wrong and fish possible getting too much slack ...but do it however you think works best...to me the drags in the new reels these days are unbelievable smooth and I never worry they won't work properly. |
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Posts: 90
Location: Ohio | bn - 6/22/2009 12:44 PM I agree w/ Ranger...use your drag correctly and you won't lose fish.. I have upgraded my Morrums to smoothies..the rest of my reels like Trinidads/TE's/Penns all have great drags in them...set them so it takes a good pull from your hand to pull out line and you will be set imo...thumbing the spool to me could lead to too many things going wrong and fish possible getting too much slack ...but do it however you think works best...to me the drags in the new reels these days are unbelievable smooth and I never worry they won't work properly. I set my Drag on my 400B to where it takes a good pull to pull line out |
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Posts: 8781
| I trust my drag WAYYY more than I trust my ability to figure 8, read the fish, thumb the spool, set the hook, and reel all at the same time. Once I set the hook? THEN I'll freespool, let the fish take some line if it needs to, etc. As for keeping the rod top low, think about it: If your rod is up in the air, what exactly can you do to control a fish? If the fish comes up, head out of the water, thrashing around, what can you do? If the fish charges right at the boat, what can you do? It just leaves you in a position to do nothing except watch the fish throw the lure. |
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setting the hooks