Does anyone really see different results using different kinds of gliders? I mean, is there a point in having a selection of hellhounds, danczyk, slammers, amma bamas and tuff shad gliders? Should i have more of a variety in my box?
Posted 1/19/2009 6:58 PM (#356113 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 44
Location: Stevens Point WI
I would try as many different ones as possible. Each one has its own "personality" and will only like to be worked certain ways (ie. slow w/ long pause, fast and eratic, any speed, etc). Fish will respond differently to different baits' actions, plus gliders are probably the most "hands on" or interactive musky bait there is, so I find them to be fun to work
Posted 1/19/2009 8:59 PM (#356136 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
Posts: 20279
Location: oswego, il
I have more glidebaits than I will ever know what to do with. With that said it is good to have a few different kinds. Some can be worked fast, while other only work well slow. Some you can get going crazy with a good snap of the wrist while some, especially bigger gliders take more of a short pull. Some will work well when the waves are going and the boat is moving all over while some take some finess to make work and work work under the aformentioned conditions. That does not make them bad baits but very good baits under calmer conditions. Some go side to side methodically while other have some up and down in their directions too. Some you can work deeper and some stay up top. Some have a short side to side while others will glide 3ft in a direction. Basically most gliders have their own personalities and using one for the situation that your in is important for a good presentation.
Posted 1/19/2009 9:34 PM (#356146 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
Posts: 392
Location: KY
I love to hate gliders. I have way too many. Most of them are hanging on the wall. I do like erratic gliders that can be used as search baits, in contrast to the classic slow gliders that are typically used in cold water. My favorites are undertakers, hellhounds, cobb's, phantoms, and mantas. You can spend a lot of money on designer gliders if you want but you don't "need" to.
Posted 1/20/2009 10:13 AM (#356198 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 159
Location: Stevens Point, WI
ToddM and BruceKY, thanks for the info. My question is, can't a guy learn to work a particular glider in different ways to make it more versatile rather than buying more baits? Undertakers and hellhounds can be worked slow and constant, fast and erratic, slow with twitches, wide or tight. Then i can use a jerbait or twitchbait to get more crazy if need be. Can you give me some situations in which you'd rather have a different glider, or are these two baits less versatile than i think?
Posted 1/20/2009 4:48 PM (#356249 - in reply to #356198) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 4266
I can work my gliders as fast as I want to and have them darting and dashing all over the place, or slow them down with light taps and have them gliding back and forth and then pause them and watch them futter down. I even stop them dead when I'm moving them fast and let them sink a little and then start it over again. Either way, fast or slow, I still get the majority of my hits from good fish on the drop.
Beav
Posted 1/20/2009 7:10 PM (#356264 - in reply to #356198) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 392
Location: KY
12gauge
You are spot on. The undertaker and hellhound are very versatile baits. They will work in most situations. So will phantoms, the Cobb’s crazy shad, or a drop belly. I don’t want to imply I have anywhere near the experience of others on this board. The undertaker might be too small for late season use. I have a couple of round nose Cobb’s that are better suited for cold water applications where a slower more methodical retrieve is called for. The manta & hang 10s are famous for gliding way out side to side, but not much else. With all gliders you are going to want to change it up to trigger strikes. tap, pause, tap, tap, long pause, tap, tap, tap, pause…….
Posted 1/20/2009 9:57 PM (#356309 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
Posts: 20279
Location: oswego, il
12 guage, it looks like you do well with two glide baits on either end of the spectrum. The hellhound is one of the easiest gliders to work, by far. The undetaker is more of a finesse glider and can be tricky but once you get it right, you can make it do tricks many gliders won't. If you can work an undertaker, then most gliders should come easy for you. Muskies like both of these gliders.
If I am fishing cover over weeds, I do not want a glider that pops up and down without my wanting it to. I run my rod tip up and use a glider that runs high, near the surface and sometimes breaking it.
For deeper water, it's rod tip down and a heavier weighted glider. Some gliders won't stay down no matter what but some do.
bn
Posted 1/20/2009 10:00 PM (#356311 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
gliders suck!
but if you are going to throw them...hellhounds, undertaker, sq phantoms and maybe a turmoil or 2 is all ya need...
use em as a last resort! ; )
Posted 1/20/2009 10:16 PM (#356313 - in reply to #356311) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 2024
The Squirko is my personal favorite. I can give it light-ish taps and send it zig-zagging smoothly side-to-side. OR I can really THWACK it and make it juke left/right, and pop up/down. Most baits (exception possibly being Mantas) can allow you to do a lot of things by varying the degree to which you snap the rod down.
They will move fish when other baits won't. Definitely should have at least one hanging around at all times.
lambeau
Posted 1/20/2009 10:17 PM (#356315 - in reply to #356311) Subject: Re: gliders
Posted 1/20/2009 10:28 PM (#356318 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 32957
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
Gliders rock. I like Beav's Perka, the Wabull, the Undertaker, Hellhound, Phantom, and all the rest, and have an entire monster Lakewood full.
Muskies eat 'em.
Mjr
Posted 1/21/2009 11:25 AM (#356376 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
I just love Tuff Shads, and I think that they are one of the Easiest to use,and fish just love them, And it does not matter what State you are fishing in. They catch fish Everywhere. Mike Sr.
Posted 1/21/2009 3:13 PM (#356450 - in reply to #356446) Subject: Re: gliders
Definately the gliders, always pick up the box later!
bn
Posted 1/21/2009 3:15 PM (#356454 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
Lakewood..
muskies do eat them but imo the return on investment is very low with gliders...ie, they are in the water a lot with really not very impressive results in general ...most of the time..sure last May me and my friends had 30 fish in my boat on them, but that is rare...
results are what counts right? how many guys on here can say they have 48+ on a glider? or say 25 fish or more per yr on gliders? they are in the water too much by too many guys..yah they look cool, but c'mon..a few fish per year on gliders isn't exactly impressive imo
get a few...know how they run/work and then find the times the fish actually do eat them over other stuff...great at moving fish when they won't move on much else...
Lakewoods first! ; )
mota
Posted 1/21/2009 4:35 PM (#356471 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posted 1/21/2009 5:37 PM (#356494 - in reply to #356076) Subject: Re: gliders
Location: SE Wisconsin
bobtodd - 1/19/2009 5:43 PM
Hellhounds are for catching WI river walleyes....you need to find a different glider bait for the muskies.
Hmm...
All time favorite is the MMT Slidin' Shad. . . I love drop bellies. On the other hand, I have always been an advocate of Hellhounds and Wabulls. . . Just never caught a walleye on the Hellhound. . . Interesting theory though.
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Posted 1/23/2009 11:32 PM (#356905 - in reply to #356494) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 337
Location: Central WI
On the other hand, I have always been an advocate of Hellhounds and Wabulls. . . Just never caught a walleye on the Hellhound. . . Interesting theory though.
I was just messing with 12 gauge...he caught a walleye this spring on a Hellhound that was just under the 30" mark. We both thought it was a muskie until the fish was in the net.
Those Slidin' Shad look like a really nice bait....
Posted 1/24/2009 10:27 AM (#356951 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 283
Wabulls and baby wabulls are my favorite since you can really make them go crazy like making them nose down and up instead of just side to side like a normal glider
Posted 1/25/2009 3:44 PM (#357145 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 159
Location: Stevens Point, WI
Thanks again for good info. I have an additional question. I throw gliders, just not many different kinds. This year we got 94 muskies and only 1 came on a glider, though hours were put into throwing them. Do you find there are some lakes where gliders just don't work, or is it more of a problem of working the wrong glider the wrong way? We get bass, walleyes, and catfish on the big gliders more than muskies. What's the deal?
bn
Posted 1/26/2009 2:07 PM (#357319 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
12 gauge...your data is about the same as most i would think...again, return on invenstment with gliders is very very low for most of the season...sure they have there time and place, just like any lure...but the i would bet that as a category they have the lowest # of truly big fish caught on them over any other lure type..
get a few good ones, know how to work them to trigger strikes and that is all you need..i use to have over 40 i think back in the day, now i have about 10
if you want to actually catch lots of fish over the course of the season...put down the gliders...most of the time.
Posted 1/26/2009 2:42 PM (#357324 - in reply to #356454) Subject: RE: gliders
Posts: 32957
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
bn - 1/21/2009 3:15 PM
Lakewood..
muskies do eat them but imo the return on investment is very low with gliders...ie, they are in the water a lot with really not very impressive results in general ...most of the time..sure last May me and my friends had 30 fish in my boat on them, but that is rare...
results are what counts right? how many guys on here can say they have 48+ on a glider? or say 25 fish or more per yr on gliders? they are in the water too much by too many guys..yah they look cool, but c'mon..a few fish per year on gliders isn't exactly impressive imo
get a few...know how they run/work and then find the times the fish actually do eat them over other stuff...great at moving fish when they won't move on much else...
Lakewoods first! ; )
Posted 1/26/2009 3:01 PM (#357331 - in reply to #357325) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 8865
Gander Mt Guide - 1/26/2009 2:44 PM
"or is it more of a problem of working the wrong glider the wrong way? "
If you're getting lazy follows or aren't seeing fish, odds are you're getting into a rythm with your retrieve. You must change up speeds and pauses.
I fished the hell out of gliders for a couple years, and had nothing but lazy follows and a few ummm "operator errors". I was doing exactly what GMG described -- a nice rythmic cadence, side to side. Hypnotized a lot of fish that way. I haven't given them a ton of time since, but I've had the opportunity to fish with a handful of "glider freaks" as I call them, and the one thing they all do differently from what I was doing is that they incorporate a lot of jerks, pauses, and erratic movements into their retrieve.
I think there's a time and a place for them, like any other lure. But the key to gliders in my opinion is making the fish want to eat them, something that I definitely plan on improving next year.
bn
Posted 1/26/2009 3:02 PM (#357335 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
i don't work them like "most people" either Steve, but numbers and results don't lie... they just aren't a lure that produces very big fish or lots of numbers...most of the time...
Posted 1/26/2009 4:36 PM (#357369 - in reply to #357335) Subject: RE: gliders
Posts: 4266
Definitely a case of The Old Bull and The Young Bull.
Young Bull wants to buldge D10's all day. Why? Because he can, that's why. The Old Bull cannot throw D10s all day or even hours of the day because The Old Bull has seen many battles and his will is strong but his flesh is tired. So The Old Bull simply reaches into his war chest and finds a weapon that he can throw as long as he can stand. That weapon doesn't require strength and stamina, it is best used with skill and the patience of The Old Bull. From skimming it with nose up to diving it with nose down The Oldest of The Old Bulls probes the water while the other Old Bull uses knowledge of the lake and finesse to tempt the water tetonka by making his weapon look like an easy meal too tempting to resist. It struggles to move, then seems to almost die as it flutters toward the bottom, and that is when the beast attacks. He watches others go by, but the ones who are dying and come to him, he eats. The Old Bulls never break a sweat, but stand in a relaxed postion with their sprear tips splashing the water's surface as they work their magic weapons. It is not the weapon that is magic, but the hands and the minds of The Old Bulls.
bn
Posted 1/26/2009 4:38 PM (#357371 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
Good story.
In the end, the Old Bull catches one fish and the Young Bull catches 5 and they are all bigger than the Old Bulls one...and the Young Bull uses the right equipment so he doesn't break a sweat either.... ; )
take your pick which Bull you want to be at the end of the day
Posted 1/26/2009 4:50 PM (#357372 - in reply to #357371) Subject: RE: gliders
Posts: 4266
UGH Young Bull who parents forgot to give name to, only 2 letters. Is that your name, "Two Letters"?
Fish what you want, I don't care. I fish what I can, and I have gliders on my rods every season of the year, and catch fish on them troughout the year. Just because you don't like them doesn't mean that they don't produce numbers or size. My 3 biggest fish have all come on gliders. One 49+" fish on Cass Lake not an hour after 160 tourney boats beat it to death for 3 days. But I was in over 30" of water and she came straight up and ate it.
Guys talk about how to work them. I bet most of the nay-sayers haven't spent a lot of time throwing them while in 30-40 feet of water away from the weeds being pounded by The Blade Runners.
Again, I don't care what you fish and where you fish and how you fish. All lures are tools, and you should know how, when and where to use them all.
Now, go get me some venison, I'm hungry.
Posted 1/26/2009 4:59 PM (#357373 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Location: Contrarian Island
Old Bull,
those 2 letters are called Initials...your parents named you Beaver then? interesting.
I never said I don't like them, well I don't love them, but let's stick to my point, point is, as far as time in the water, there are plenty of lures that will produce better (again, most of the time) it's all about where and when like you say, if you would have read an earlier post of mine in this thread, I pointed out that in my boat in just the month of May, 30 fish were put in the net on ...GLIDERS.
so I think I know a thing or 2 about how to work them to trigger strikes...and I know a thing or 2 about putting big muskies and lots of them in the boat...I know I'm not whatever age you are, and I've "only" been musky fishing for 15 yrs..but my point is, gliders just don't produce for the amount of hours they are in the water by the majority of guys who throw them...I know plenty of full time guides who put hundreds of fish in the boat that would probably agree to my point...
one Young Bull. I did like your story though... ; )
bn
Edited by MSKY HNR 1/26/2009 5:03 PM
lambeau
Posted 1/26/2009 5:12 PM (#357375 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Jim Saric (i guess he'd be a "middle-aged bull"?) detailed his 143 muskies over 50" in this month's Musky Hunter.
73 bucktails
30 topwater
24 crankbait
8 plastic
4 minnowbait
4 jerkbait
gliders are fun, and fun matters.
they even produce fish when worked right under the right conditions.
their big limitation is that the conditions usually favor other presentations.
in years past i spent a lot of hours having fun with gliders instead of catching fish; now i reach for them when fish aren't moving on other presentations.
Posted 1/26/2009 5:36 PM (#357379 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 231
Beaver, I don't know what it is about Cass, but those toothy critters flat out love those dang nang gliders. whether it's buckbar, little wishbone, allens bay, ect. I'm one of those "Young bulls" you're referring to, but I do love the gliders when I'm on Cass. That was a funny read, & Brad's response made me laugh too. It's all good!
Posted 1/26/2009 5:39 PM (#357380 - in reply to #357373) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 4266
Chillax Brad. That's what I love about the internet. People can't tell what the tone of your comment is. If you knew me, you'd know that I am seldom serious about something that is fun like muskie fishing. Sworrall and I constantly joke about being The Old Bulls, in fact The Wabull was named for The Walking Bulls, our fishing team name.
I fish gliders a lot because they are easy for me to fish. My back is majorly screwed up and I am not physically able to chunk and wind all day long. Hell, I can only fish gliders for an hour or so before I have to take an hour long break.
I love gliders. I have Steve beat by a long shot. I have one Lakewood just full of HR's and one full of lures that I make and more than that. I also throw rubber, bucktails, spinnerbaits and love throwing Grandmas and crankbaits. I throw lots of stuff, and think that it's important to know how to fish all of the various types of lures. Do gliders outfish other lures on a constant basis. No. Is there one lure that is the best lure every day? No. So don't think that I was serious about my story. It was meant for chuckles, not to call you out. But it also contained some fact. Many guys will badmouth gliders without working them correctly or in areas where they should give them a try. You're obviously not a 'one trick pony', but I'm sure that you know people as I do who will throw one lure from dawn til dusk with the mentality that the fish WILL eat this if I throw it enough.
It's interesting how gliders get singled out. Why? I throw the hell out of topwaters and I think that they suck. They are exciting to use, but the hooking percentage sucks. Are they worth throwing? I've caught many muskies on bucktails with one blade. Now that every bucktail-type lure has two huge blades on it, does that mean that the Mepps is outdated. I think all lures suck sometime. But I'm not going to stop throwing them, buying them, or telling people that they are not worth buying or using.
I guess Sworrall will read my post and laugh.
I wonder what percentage of the time Saric threw all of those lures? It only stands to reson that if someone trolls, they are going to catch the majority of their fish on crankbaits. Saric has the luxury that most of us don't......fishing all season long. I've never read anything that he has written on glider fishing, so I can only assume that he doesn't fish them much.
Edited by Beaver 1/26/2009 6:21 PM
mota
Posted 1/26/2009 7:59 PM (#357410 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
more catch on topwater vs crankbait,sound very strange considering where he fish
Posted 1/26/2009 8:18 PM (#357414 - in reply to #357335) Subject: RE: gliders
Posts: 32957
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin
bn - 1/26/2009 3:02 PM
i don't work them like "most people" either Steve, but numbers and results don't lie... they just aren't a lure that produces very big fish or lots of numbers...most of the time...
They do for me. I catch big muskies on gliders all year long, and put some decent numbers in the boat with them, too. One of my favorite applications is a Wabull or Undertaker in what most folks would call 'slop'. Pop that glider along just sub surface sometimes breaking the top, walking across some stuff and then hit a pocket....nose it down, let it pause.......
Some days, especially on flowages up in the stuff, that presentation rules.
Beav, you are a hoot, that soliloquy was great! I think I'm going to catch a fish on a White Pine cone this year.
Posted 1/26/2009 8:58 PM (#357427 - in reply to #357414) Subject: RE: gliders
Posts: 968
Location: N.FIB
I think most people don`t use gliders long enough to give them a chance at a fish,it all goes down to what you like to throw.Gliders can be a pain to work all day,not as easy as throwing a bucktail or a topwater,they can really be a pain in your back after an hour so you need to take an hour break.If I could only throw one lure all day it would be a glider,I think they ROCK.
Posted 1/26/2009 10:24 PM (#357459 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 1759
Location: Mt. Zion, IL
I am sort of new to fishing gliders. It seems that most of you fish them very erratically. Is this what is desired? It is not desired to fish them like a WTD topwater bait with a steady cadence? Is the idea to really make them dance in all directions? I have only a few gliders and I am still sort of learning how to use them. Currently I own Reef Hawgs, Hellhounds, Magic Makers, and one Hang 10 Manta. I cannot get the Reef Hawgs to go sideways at all and mine fish more like Suicks it seems. Am I on the right track or way off here?
Posted 1/26/2009 11:19 PM (#357466 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
Posts: 432
Location: mpls
I catch lots and BIG fish on gliders. I think that most people look for and want a glider that just glides back and forth. when people on forums talk about gliders that they like, it usually goes something like this," I love the _____ glider. It's so easy to work!". What they don't say is they haven't ever caught anything on it! When looking for a glider you should be looking for that "something special". The little wobble. The belly roll. The shimmy on the pause. Yeah, it should glide easy to, but that should be just the price of admission. Not the only thing . I also agree with Sworral, same action = same results. If all you get are lazy follows from that "hypnotic side to side". Don't do the hypnotic side to side. Mix it up, work it fast, slow, ect.
Anyway- take em or leave em. There are a 100's of other ways to catch fish. Find the way you like. I'll take gliders .
Joe
Trueglide.com
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Posted 1/27/2009 2:26 PM (#357584 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 256
I love gliders! I have had a bit of luck on Bitten Warlocks and Phantoms. I was lucky enough to get a trueglide at the Chicago show. I hope to wreck the beautiful paint job this summer with some teeth marks!
Old Guy
Posted 1/27/2009 4:14 PM (#357606 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
To RyanJoz
The Reefhawg is a great bait but I don't see it a true glider though.
It can be fished many ways but think of it as a 'tap' bait. Give it a couple of pulls to get it down then tap it at an erratic pace on a tight to almost tight line. Vary the length/strength of the tap and the time between taps and throw in a rip when you feel like. It goes all over the place-side to side plus up and down.
As I understand it, the bait is meant to have erratic motion not the rhythmic side-to side of a true glider. There are some which will do the side to side thing naturally however. For my money, I'd buy a glide bait with a reputation for good side to side swing if that's what you want but reefhawgs can me true magic.
Maybe some real reefhawg experts will chime in here.
reef hawg
Posted 1/28/2009 7:51 PM (#357855 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
12 guage. Sounds like you are doing pretty well without them ehh? Nice to have one rigged on stretch x, though, especially in spring and fall. Not a tool for covering water while floating downstream, but great to have one rigged for when you get to the sweet zones. Brad, I'd agree with you for the places/lakes you fish. However, spend some time in cooler water periods on a river with alot of current(which I expect you probably won't), and you'll grasp the glider as a handy tool in certain situations, and big fish eat them every year. Not any glider will do in the heavy current, with the flat sided stuff usually staying home(other than phantoms and the old Castor in my case, Nitro in light current).
Posted 1/29/2009 12:54 AM (#357909 - in reply to #357375) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 1504
Location: Oregon
lambeau - 1/26/2009 5:12 PM
Jim Saric (i guess he'd be a "middle-aged bull"?) detailed his 143 muskies over 50" in this month's Musky Hunter.
73 bucktails
30 topwater
24 crankbait
8 plastic
4 minnowbait
4 jerkbait
These are amazing statistics.........wow!
What would be interesting is to know how much of his total time was spent fishing each of the lures in the above list. He caught roughly 50% of the 143 fish on bucktails but is he fishing bucktails 50% or 90% of the time? If he's throwing bucktails 90% of the time then a 50% statistic isn't as impressive. If he is throwing each of the baits in the above list an equal amount of time, which I sincerely doubt he is, then the 50% caught on bucktails would be very impressive.
No doubt bucktails and spinnerbaits are effective but it is important to remember that you will catch fish on lures you choose to spend time fishing. And finally, bucktails are a pretty straight forward bait that most anglers can fish correctly while not everyone can fish a glider properly.
RM
Edited by RiverMan 1/29/2009 1:06 AM
Dirt Esox
Posted 1/29/2009 8:12 AM (#357929 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
In my experience gliders are a last resort. Rythmic or erratic retrieve, still seems to show a lot more fish than trigger them. Once the I got over how cool HR's were I realized most of the time other baits are a better option for getting them to eat in most situations. I still catch fish on gliders but it's usually early spring and on shad based water. Now instead of having an entire flambeau box full of gliders I have a Hellhound, Warlock, Slammer drop belly, and two HR's for when times are tough, I've gone from throwing them 40% of the time to about 5% and my numbers and average size have gone up dramatically. Again, just my experience with them in MN/IA/NW Ont.
Guest
Posted 1/29/2009 8:46 AM (#357937 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
Gliders are not the best choice, nor are they the 2nd, 3rd, or 4th pick in my board for a big fish.
Do they work, yes. Are the great at catching Big fish, not really.
Sure there are big fish caught on them, but not in huge amounts.
Also there are two types of gliders in my opinion. Erratic and not just plain jane left to right. I really hate the plain jane left to right, same ol' same ol gliders. Lots of lazy lookers but very few fish in the boat. People like them because they can MOVE fish on them, but catch rates are pretty low. The erratic gliders do a decent job of catching fish, but they have to have several components. Belly roll, up, down, left, right, left, down, up, right, left, right, down, etc....these style of gliders are more effective at catching.
If you spend half your time throwing a glider and half you time throwing other baits, your stats would not show 50% caught on gliders and 50% on other baits. They just aren't the most effective baits out there. Sure they do work, they do catc fish, but not consistantly.
Posted 1/29/2009 9:19 AM (#357942 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 654
Location: MPLS, MN
I only really use Gliders on hot sunny blue bird days on Shield Lakes over shallow rocks and major cold fronts. They shine over everything else in those situations in my experiance.
Posted 1/29/2009 9:27 AM (#357944 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 2024
I mainly throw gliders if I need to move fish because they often do that when nothing else will. Once I've moved the fish I switch baits (usually to a crankbait or bucktail). I have missed a lot of nice fish on these baits which has caused them to move down in the line-up.
Ryan,
Grab yourself a Squirko or Hellhound and pop away in the timber!
Posted 1/29/2009 9:54 AM (#357955 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
Posts: 432
Location: mpls
I will refrain from posting anything that may seem negative.
I would love to know how many "big Fish" ( over 50"). some of you have experience catching? I say this, because there is at least one post on this thread from a person claiming that gliders do not catch big fish - in his opinion. I know this person, and he has never caught a fish over 42". I am not calling that out to take anything away from his fishing skills or his dedication. Just pointing out that you have to be vary of the source when getting your information from people that may seem knowledgable. Personally I lose very few fish on gliders and the biggest fish that I know of on my baits is 56". AND many more over 50". Of course I fish gliders more than most, so no point in saying the % . The point is- everyone has an opinion, and Muskie fishermen usually have more than one
Fish every style of bait you can. Have fun . Don't disregard something,because an "expert" has a differing opinion. My Dad once caught a smallmouth on a piece of corn and 40pound test.Just to prove to me that I was spending to much$ on baits and that fish were dumb.
Joe
Trueglide.com
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Posted 1/29/2009 10:04 AM (#357958 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
Location: Contrarian Island
Joe,
In the last 5 seasons there have been over 500 fish in my boat...I think that is a pretty good sample size to go from...
I use to be a glider freak, I think we all go thru that phase starting out musky fishing, at one time I had more gliders than I could put in my boat but found, as many others do, they don't put that many fish in the net for the countless hours we were fishing them...look at Sarics stats, or anyone that catches lots of fish..sure there is some self fullfilling prophecy there as JLong would say as you are going to catch fish on what you throw...but in reality, if you want to catch lots of fish, and big ones, gliders are not the best choice ....I still use them and catch plenty of fish on them, but imo I don't throw "gliders" and work mine so erratic and fast that to me, they almost become twitch baits....to me, the return on investment is low...they don't produce that well under the majority of conditions so they become a specific bait for a specific set of conditions, whether thats water temp, weather, fish activity level etc...under those conditions they do work, very well in fact...but that set of conditions isn't all the time..if angler A threw a glider all year and angler B threw a bucktail all year...I'd bet my visor angler B would have more fish in the boat ...
i'm not out there to get skunked...catching fish is fun, catching lots of fish is even better.
I do see your point though...the terms "big fish" and "a lot of fish" are all relative and could mean quite a few things to different people...to me, getting a few fish or even 10 in a season on one type of bait is not "a lot"
Posted 1/29/2009 10:54 AM (#357972 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
Location: SE Wisconsin
When I started fishing tournaments, bucktails spent the majority of the time on my rod, rarely changing the pace. My thought was that bucktails produce, they cover a lot of water fast and the odds should be in my favor. Fishing a tournament, of course you want to increase your odds, so why not cover as much water as possible with a bait that is capable of the task?
I love bucktails, in fact, their probably one of my favorite arsenols! I love the smoothness on the retrieve and the feeling right before a fish sucks it in. Ever notice how when a fish has its nose to the bucktail, just before he sucks it in the light pulse of the blades skips a beat? I love that, it's cool.
GLIDERS, however, are a phenominal bait IMO. It is the one solid bait that I can retrieve and replicate an injured fish or a mindless fish that feels like taking an evening swim, yet has no real direction as to where it goes.
I don't think gliders catch smaller fish. . . Look at the 50% of you who don't throw them often. . . Do you really wonder why the bait doesn't have as many BIG fish to its name as the baits you throw regularly? I, personally, caught my biggest fish on a glider on a local Lake Country Lake here in SE Wisconsin. . . I also throw them quite a bit, but I believe in them. I think that's everything. If you have confidence in a lure, stemming from your know-how of working the lure, you should be able to produce. Throwing them when nothing else is moving? Why?
Bucktails catch fish that are active and on the hunt . . . for the most part. Gliders, twitch baits like Slammers, Jakes and Grandmas, Suicks and Super Shads are great for the BIG girls who are sitting patiently for the unfortunate prey that crosses its path and hangs in its face for a moment, enticing. Think about it.
Musky Magic makes one of the best, HANDS DOWN, gliders on the market. If you haven't thrown one, you're missing out. . . That's why I talk about them all the time. Their awesome if you know how to use them. They make the drop belly Slidin' Shad, which, IMO, have many more capalities then a straight glider, like a Hellhound. Drop bellies give you a slight belly role for flash and erratic behavior, and on the glide they tilt to a slight angle rather then a straight left to right. That's what seperates the from the rest. . . A realistic appeal.
Posted 1/29/2009 11:42 AM (#357984 - in reply to #357955) Subject: RE: gliders
Location: SE Wisconsin
uptown - 1/29/2009 9:54 AM
there is at least one post on this thread from a person claiming that gliders do not catch big fish - in his opinion. I know this person, and he has never caught a fish over 42".
All to true in so many instances. This is the internet, however, infrances can be made more often than not, suggesting the ones who catch BIG fish and achieve a high success rate are the modest ones. They don't accuse certain baits or techniques as being bad or wrong, rather, they wait till the time is right to share knowledge on a topic they see all the angles of.
Posted 1/29/2009 12:02 PM (#357989 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
Posts: 90
I have to be honest guys, these all encompassing statements of gliders don't catch numbers or large fish are just irritating. Perhaps they don't for you, but I have seen some pretty nice fish taken by Norm Wild on a Wabull the past couple seasons and I have to say I don't buy into the big fish don't eat gliders aspect of the argument. Me personally, on the other hand, I tried a Wabull for the first time last season, and immediately sold it. Not because I didn't think it would catch fish or big fish, but I clearly didn't know how to use it properly to make the presentation look appealing from my end of things. Could I learn, sure, but my time on the water was restricted to about 10 days last season and that didn't leave opportunities to experiment in my opinion. So I stuck with what I know best and that is an "outdated" overused solid black suick that I am comfortable knowing it will put fish in the boat. In fact my last time out last season with my brother, he used a Topraider almost exclusively and I used that black suick almost exclusively, and much to my surprise the majority of the fish he caught were on a Topraider and mine were on a suick. Doesn't mean that Suicks don't work in the front of the boat and Topraiders in the back...does it? The point is that everyone is entitled to an opinion, and everyone is entitled to a preference and typically your results will speak to those two factors, but that doesn't make anyone elses opinions or preferences wrong.
Posted 1/29/2009 12:12 PM (#357990 - in reply to #357984) Subject: RE: gliders
Posts: 4266
Alas, I must comment again. I see the debate rages on, and that's good. Whether you are pro or con, I bet you have gliders in your box.
One thing caught my attention in some of the first posts, and it has been said before, guys love Hellhounds. They're easy to fish. I used to love many different gliders (I love my own the most of course) that I no longer own. Hellhounds and Undertakers for example. Why? Well, IMO gliders of that size just don't raise the interest of big fish. I'm not saying small gliders don't catch fish, I'm saying if you stick with 6", small profile baits, you'll catch more small fish than big. My glider fishing really improved when I started throwing lures in the 8-10" range. Big lures=Big fish? With gliders I'd have to say so. An 8" baitfish is a snack to a big fish, so is a 10" I guess, but I like bigger profiles, and so do the biggest fish that I've caught. I'm outlining patterns on some exotic woods right now, and none of them are smaller than 8".
There still is a time and place for smaller gliders, but when I'm on big fish waters the little guys stay home.
Beav
Posted 1/29/2009 12:59 PM (#358004 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 159
Location: Stevens Point, WI
Good point, Beaver. I can't get the picture out of my head of a 49 incher that was found here washed up on shore with a 12 pound carp sticking out of its throat. That would be a big glider.
BUT, one of my original questions has yet to be answered to my liking. You guys who fish gliders, are there bodies of water where they work and others where they don't? Are some lakes "glider" lakes and others not at all, or are the fish really not that picky?
Posted 1/29/2009 1:12 PM (#358008 - in reply to #358004) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 8865
12gauge - 1/29/2009 12:59 PM
Good point, Beaver. I can't get the picture out of my head of a 49 incher that was found here washed up on shore with a 12 pound carp sticking out of its throat. That would be a big glider.
BUT, one of my original questions has yet to be answered to my liking. You guys who fish gliders, are there bodies of water where they work and others where they don't? Are some lakes "glider" lakes and others not at all, or are the fish really not that picky?
I've fished a LOT of lakes where they don't work!!
Seriously though, that's a good question. I may be wrong here, but I think it's more situational than lake specific. That is, gliders work well under certain CONDITIONS. I've heard there isn't a glider bite at all on Eagle for example, but then I'm up there in August, when everybody is throwing the same 4 lures -- double 10's, Dawgs, Grandmas and depthraiders. If they're going on tails, you'd be silly to even TRY a glider.
I'd say a safer statement would be something like "gliders don't typically produce on _______ until the water temp gets below 40 late in the fall" and not that they just don't work at all. All muskies are muskies after all. There might be slight differences in how different strains behave, or between hybrids and purestrain muskies, but I believe they will ALL eat a glider at one time or another no matter where you are.
Posted 1/29/2009 1:15 PM (#358009 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 2089
Old Guy,
Nuts on about the Reef Hawg. I consider them more of a twitch bait myself. I never go to LOTW without an handful of 6" ers. My personal best came on a 20 year old version. My buddy asked why I was throwing the old ,cracked, minimal paint version and my reply was"'cause this thing runs like a B^%$#". Steve
Posted 1/29/2009 1:19 PM (#358010 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Location: SE Wisconsin
A glider looks like a wounded or unaware forage fish that is appealing to a predator, like the musky. IMO, different lakes, etc. make no difference in what lures work better than others. I think that's merely a myth stemmed from rumors of what was working well one day or week for one or a couple different sources. Any lake that has musky, has forage. . . A musky must eat to survive, such that when a temptation like a glide bait is hanging in the predators face, your odds are as good in one lake as they are in the next of that fish taking the bait.
It is safe to say, however, that some lakes are easier fished with certain presentations, such as deep crater lakes vs shallow lakes with weed flats. As your own guide, you must surmise what presentation would work best depending on your circumstances. Structure and cover along with depth and time of day all play an inaugeral role.
So, no, there aren't reasonably any lakes where a musky prefers gliders over the next lake, just lakes where given the layout of your playing field, a glider may be more suitable to use then in a different area/lake.
Edited by Sam Ubl 1/29/2009 1:24 PM
Guest
Posted 1/29/2009 1:25 PM (#358012 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
Posted 1/29/2009 1:28 PM (#358013 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 897
I don't get why people care whether others throw gliders or not. Personally, I've caught 7 fish over 41", including a 51" on them in the past year. I took my fishing partner and others to school this year throwing one particular glider that no one ever seems to talk about. Love it! That being said, out of my 6 fish over 48" in the past two years, all but the glider 51" has been on a double cowgirl. Bet ya can't guess what two lures I use most of the time! Like every other lure, gliders have their time and place.
Also, on a bit of a tangent, I must say I have a lot more confidence in the fish catching ability of my favorite glider than any walk-the-dog topwater I've ever used. Heavy gliders rarely get thrown on the strike. Sure, they get missed all the time, but no more than a WTD.
-Chris
Edited by whynot 1/29/2009 1:32 PM
jackpot bay
Posted 1/29/2009 1:28 PM (#358014 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
the internet is a funny thing, guys can talk a big game but their actual numbers don't back it up. So some of you glider freaks, care to actually put numbers down and not just "a lot" or "big".
How many fish did you actually put in the net on gliders last season. Of those, how many were over 45"?
Seems to me there are plenty of guys who sure can type like they boat "a lot" of fish on gliders, but never say how many, or how many hours it took to get those fish.
Posted 1/29/2009 2:37 PM (#358031 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Location: SE Wisconsin
What you are missing here is the point. A glider stands as good of a chance at putting a fish in the boat as any other lure, given you're doing it the right way and your using it efficiently, i.e. Using it in an effective location with cover/structure that coinside with the effectiveness of the lure.
What I'm missing is why the continuous effort to bash a lure type? I guess if you don't like them, don't use them. . . What more can anyone really say to someone who feels sooo strongly? I must stress that as someone who questions those who make such statements as "big" or "a lot", be sure to ask yourself how many hours YOU'VE given your nemesis lure in the water.
Posted 1/29/2009 2:59 PM (#358036 - in reply to #358031) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 4266
Sorry, it's cold and my ruler is smaller than usual.
It's still a very small profile which is why it catches bass and walleyes as well as muskies, I'm sure. I just think your odds go up for bigger fish when you use big profile gliders. Just my humble opinion.
I also think if you are not a troller, crankbaits suck.
Topwaters are the worse hooking lures in the box.
Dive/rise lures are the smallest niche bait that there is.
Spinnerbaits rule, but people quit fishing them.
You can catch fish on bucktails all year long, but why only fish one lure?
You can pound your Pounder.
Muskies have brains the size of a pea, and you can catch them using the neighbors cat if you could rig one up properly. But could it swim long enough?
Suckers suck.....litterally.
Grandmas catch fish year round, but they fish waaaay too slow for the average guy to use them for long. Like throwing a Hawg Wobbler all day. Shoot me first!
You can cover lots of water with fast moving lures, and just as much with slower moving lures, but it takes longer.
I'd rather read Sornos thread.
Posted 1/29/2009 4:08 PM (#358045 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 16632
Location: The desert
Why is everything about who caught the most and who caught the biggest? I caught some fish last year, both here in Utah and back in Wisconsin, more in Utah than in Wisconsin. Every single Utah fish was on a glider, most of my fish in Wisconsin were on topraiders, but some were on gliders, some were on weagles, some were on bucktails. I didnt keep track, I just enjoyed the time on the water and time with friends. Isnt that what it's really about?
jackpot bay
Posted 1/29/2009 4:14 PM (#358048 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
yes and no.
when someone wants advice on a certain tactic or presentation they aren't asking about how fun it was or wasn't. they want to know from those who actually DO, not the ones that just say they do on the internet. imo.
Posted 1/29/2009 4:35 PM (#358058 - in reply to #358045) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 8865
Pointerpride102 - 1/29/2009 4:08 PM
Why is everything about who caught the most and who caught the biggest? I caught some fish last year, both here in Utah and back in Wisconsin, more in Utah than in Wisconsin. Every single Utah fish was on a glider, most of my fish in Wisconsin were on topraiders, but some were on gliders, some were on weagles, some were on bucktails. I didnt keep track, I just enjoyed the time on the water and time with friends. Isnt that what it's really about?
Looks like Mr Bolinski has reached the "enlightenment stage" of muskie fishing...
In answer to your question, Mike...
YES, it is. But the lakes are frozen right now in WI, IL, MN, etc. If we didn't talk about size and numbers and gliders and tournaments and all that?
Well, we'd...
uhhhh
Hmph
something, I guess. How big was that fish again?
bn
Posted 1/29/2009 4:37 PM (#358059 - in reply to #356047) Subject: RE: gliders
EA, I've got some gliders I want to sell...wanna buy em?? ; )
winternet is in full swing!
I love gliders, I really do!
Posted 1/29/2009 4:51 PM (#358061 - in reply to #358059) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 8865
Only if they are 2000 - 2002 8" HR Shakers, Brad.
I admit it, I like gliders. Fun to fish, fun to watch, easy to work. They look like a fish ought to just swim up and smash them any second. Any second now. Well, maybe any minute. Yep, any minute now... ok, ok, let' use hours instead.
Posted 1/29/2009 5:21 PM (#358069 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 189
Location: West Bend, WI
I've never caught a fish on a glider. I admit I generally fish other kind of baits. I own a slidin shad and a dunwright dancer. I did use them last fall with no success. I noticed when I use them, generally they are just under the surface. I know the slowly sink, but that is tough to get deep. How deep do you guys fish them? Is there a certain glider then gets down deep, like 15 ft or more? In fall I spend time fishing a gin clear lake with cisco, I'd like to to use a glider down in the depths and bounce it around. Any ideas?
Posted 1/29/2009 9:01 PM (#358119 - in reply to #356047) Subject: Re: gliders
Posts: 210
Location: VA
Say what you want, Gliders and I get along like chocolate cake and chocolate icing. A VERY high percentage of my musky are on gliders, WAY above 50%. Yes, you'll pull some fish, yes you'll miss a few, but at times they can be very productive as well. My last 5 fish all came on gliders, 3 of them in one day, every bite was 100% hookup. You guys can send me all the gliders you dont like to fish with, I'll be happy to let my fish scar them up for you.
Posted 1/29/2009 11:45 PM (#358132 - in reply to #357972) Subject: RE: gliders
Posts: 1504
Location: Oregon
Bucktails catch fish that are active and on the hunt . . . for the most part. Gliders, twitch baits like Slammers, Jakes and Grandmas, Suicks and Super Shads are great for the BIG girls who are sitting patiently for the unfortunate prey that crosses its path and hangs in its face for a moment, enticing. Think about it.
Very well said..........
This is a good discussion, it is interesting to hear the different ideas concerning baits.
gliders
