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Posts: 512
Location: Appleton | Just wondering where things are headed during these times. Are boat dealers going to have to slash prices to sell or lower interest rates to move units. How is this going to effect your spending. Hopefully many can give good news and say they will continue on spending. Who's going to buy new toys this season? Are bait prices going to come back down? What kinda turnout will there be at musky shows? Just thinking out loud I guess. If you have good news to report please do since I get kinda tired of hearing all bad on the news. I personally hope to continue to do things as I normally would. If news doesn't look worse before spring I hope to add a new boat. I might cut back on a few baits and reels but mostly cause my inventory is pretty high already. The decrease in gas prices will also allow a little extra for the time being. What do you see as we move forward? How about guides will this effect the amount days you have booked? has it already? Feel free to post any and all thoughts. |
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| the boat industry has already been hit extremely hard with drastically reduced sales. i suppose people are less likely to buy new luxury items like boats right now, and also credit it much harder to come by than ever before because the banks don't have the cash to lend out. it's already meant reduced options available to consumers from certain brands, and it could easily mean some companies going out of business if they aren't diverse enough to weather things.
my wife and i are both fortunate to work public sector jobs that are very secure. downward pressure on the economy is actually good for us in some ways, as our investment dollars buy more. that's not true for everyone, and i'm betting that it will definitely show up in reduced sales across the board this winter.
personally i'll be spending as much or more at the shows this year than in the past...but i'll be trying harder to negotiate with sellers that i think will generally see lower sales and will be more willing to drop their prices to make a sale.
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Posts: 393
Location: Hopefully on the water | If you are in a position to buy it is a very good time. With that said also realize other need to eat and survive off of what you are buying. You don't nessicarily have to get something for nothing but can still get a very good deal that still benefits you and the dealer or private party. If the gas prices stay down it could help send people north during the summer and use the toys they have or looking at getting.
As far as hearing "bad news" I personally think you are going to hear more and more before it gets better. I get to hear from customers how slow it is and talks about lay-offs, cut backs, going out of buisness and yes it gets old. But it is the reality right now. The positivie on this is if you have a job and getting your hours it is something to be grateful for during this time.
As far as baits go this year. I am sure I will be purchasing some new but not as many as in the past. This year will be restocking and adding to the baits that have worked for me in the past not the "That looks neat". I am going to try and not buy on the impluse but more of what has worked. Hopefully unload a good chunk of baits that sit in the basement all year round not even seeing the water.
Better times for the economy are ahead it is riding out the storm and realizing if the new XYZ is a good time to buy it or to hold onto your money now. |
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Location: Land of the Musky | My lure sales are down about 60% over the last 2 months. Funny thing is, my business plan is to increase lure production about 4x right now. I see it as an opportunity but then my prices are very aggressive for musky/pike lures and I hope to see sales up soon as I know many do not want to stop fishing but if they can buy two SuperDs vs one "xyz" swimbait then my lure sales will go up in 2009. At least that is my plan  I hope to have about 30 lure lines out in 2009 in over 1000 color/lure combinations. SKU wise that will make me the biggest musky lure company in the market so it is do or die for me in 2009!!! |
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Location: minocqua, wi. | the economic reality of last year changed my habbits a lot! i didn't buy a single lure during the season last year and never felt that i "didn't have" what i wanted at any given time. the cost of hobbies are what they are and continually adding to something that i already had just didn't make any sense. i've got a stable of baits that can do the job and i've tended more toward balancing the time/money equation to my overall free-time than adding "stuff" to what i've already got invested.
i could sell half of what i've got and still have plenty to do the job.
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| I've been selling lures I don't really need, and have refrained from buying stuff. I bought two lures last year, and likely will buy fewer than that this year. I also now have a "fishing fund" that I'm using for next season's adventures. Pretty much any money that isn't regular income goes in the fishing fund. Last year's GST refund, money from selling old lures, my tax refund, the $600 economic stimulus check, a few mail in rebates... Amazing how fast it adds up really.
Spending less all around, really. Fewer nights at the bar, fewer drinks when I do go, lots of coupon clipping, bargain shopping, etc. Been taking public transportation to work. Not fun, but it's a lot cheaper than driving.
All that money I'd normally spend without thinking is going right towards my mortgage. $100/month now = about $70,000 and 7 years less on my mortgage over the long term.
The current state of the economy is going to force a lot of people to learn what "enough" really is and isn't. |
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Posts: 512
Location: Appleton | esoxaddict - 12/15/2008 1:27 PM
I've been selling lures I don't really need, and have refrained from buying stuff. I bought two lures last year, and likely will buy fewer than that this year. I also now have a "fishing fund" that I'm using for next season's adventures. Pretty much any money that isn't regular income goes in the fishing fund. Last year's GST refund, money from selling old lures, my tax refund, the $600 economic stimulus check, a few mail in rebates... Amazing how fast it adds up really.
Spending less all around, really. Fewer nights at the bar, fewer drinks when I do go, lots of coupon clipping, bargain shopping, etc. Been taking public transportation to work. Not fun, but it's a lot cheaper than driving.
All that money I'd normally spend without thinking is going right towards my mortgage. $100/month now = about $70,000 and 7 years less on my mortgage over the long term.
The current state of the economy is going to force a lot of people to learn what "enough" really is and isn't.
So with some of these cut backs is it that you have to cut back or just want to cut back. I won't disagree with anything you said just curious about how things really are. I know that sometimes with all the bad news on Tv, Newspapers, Internet and such some will just cut because they feel like have to. Or maybe it's just a case of seeing some of these things makes you mindful of "wasteful" spending. I for one have cut back on fast food spending mainly cause it makes me fatter and really isn't that cheap. I'm hoping this is a "want" to cut back and not "need" to cut back because I really wanted the tone of this post to be up beat and not more doom and gloom.
Edited by Team Rhino 12/15/2008 1:39 PM
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Location: Land of the Musky | I think it also depends on what your level of comfort is and if you are riding up against that barrier. My buddy has a great job at Ford, big house, nice car, etc. but he just backed out on our 2009 Canada trip because he said he may need that $1500 come summer if all goes wrong and he is let go. In his case he has a lot of disposable cash but if he is fired he will have about 3 months and then its would be hard times for him. I won't be buying a lot but I never do. I bought most my musky lures on eBay and sold about 30% this year because I did not use most of them over the last two years. I think we are all in it for about 2-3 years until things revolve back to an uptrend. |
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| Very little spending on gear, tackle, baits, etc. As I don't need any more in those categories. More focused on saving the money that used to be spent on gear, tackle and baits, to put into savings for that "rainy day" just in case something should happen on the job front. In regards to fishing, money is now spent on gas for truck and boat and food and regular maintenance on truck and boat to try and ward off any big, expensive repairs down the road. A little money here and there on regular, routine maintenance on your current boat and truck can save big money and problems down the road...hopefully. That alone still puts me on the water and still allows for money to be put into the bank.
Right now...for some...it may simply be a time of "survival mode" as I know way too many people that are loosing their jobs. Right now it's about maintaining and enjoying what you have. Putting off those luxurious and unnecessary items for a later date when the economy does rebound.
For some, this may even mean less trips.
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| Well... I still have a job and I haven't had to take a pay cut. But there's a real possibility that I will lose my job, and as the economy and my industry retract it will become increasingly difficult for me to find another one, and certainly not for the money I make now. (Which is not a lot, but I am paid well for what I do...)
So do I "NEED" to cut back? Well, I need to prepare for the possibility that I might be unemployed soon, and for an unknown period of time. I've got a big mortgage on an empty lot up North that won't ever have a house on it unless I either find a way to make a lot more money or spend a lot less...
I'm not in danger of starving or being homeless, but I think I can speak for everyone right now and say that we definitely all need to be making wise choices.
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Location: Watertown, MN | Being hit 3 weeks ago, I would suspect a slow down in new boat sales, I would suspect attendance will be slighty down at the shows. Its a tought market out there right know, and things are not getting any better. Jonesi is going to teaching, so one guide hanging up the hat, I would suspect guide dates booked will go down slightly.
Plenty of money out there business and people are not spending for fear of what is coming, and this is stalling the economy. We were at a chrismas party saturday and most people are saving there money and paying down debt for fear of what is coming. Heard the other day that consumer spending down, and that for the first time the average person debt has declined.
Good luck
Troyz
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| Also fortunate to have a job in the public sector.
It won't change my fishing habits a bit. I'll still get out as much as I did in the past and am probably one of the few who has his eyes peeled for both a new truck and a boat. Might happen, or it might not.
One thing that will change is that for bait purchases I will intentionally lean towards investing in more of the custom made stuff to fill my new bait desire simply because the little guy cranking things out in his basement will have a more direct use for my 15-20 bucks per bait than going to a big box Gander Mountain type store. In general that's always been my approach...to patronize the mom and pop type gas stations, stores, etc. instead of the over commercialized places. Might cost a little more on my end but it helps out the mainstreet right in my backyard which needs it more than the Wal-Mart economy. |
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Posts: 27
Location: FORT ATKINSON | With the higher gas prices and cost of everything going up,I did not get to go on a fraction of the muskie trips that I go on most every year. I also didn't get to enter any tournaments this year(the first time I have not fished the PMTT in five years) Next year I hope to resume some of the muskie trips that I used to take. I hope that the economy turns around. I here the same things on other outdoor fourms that I visit,pretty sad being that the outdoor industries contribute a good amount to the economy and outdoors people are the last to cut back on their spending. |
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| being one on the flip side a lure maker i have seen a slight downturn on some products, while others are better sales. as for great lakes fishing i received a statement from the folks that do stats. lake st clair is down in fishermen and boating by approx 50 per-cent. staggering numbers for sure. with gasoline at a peak 08 stretched budgets.. one thing we doo is spend our dollars on north american products. personally i believe its the only way to go. |
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| Well I also have a job in the public sector and my employer hasn't agreed to a new contract in 2 years now,but that's really nothing new.They always like to collect interest on my money before giving it to me. Although there is alot of fighting over health insurance this year which was expected. There is even rumor of them giving us a service credit which would allow me to retire as soon as it's settled but don't really think it's going to happen. My wife has a good job and makes alot more than I do. I asked her if she thinks the economy might affect her job and she didn't think so because of the service she provides. It actually saves employers and employees money in the long run. I used to have to scrimp for one trip to Canada but the last 2 years have made 2 trips each year for 2 and a half weeks and am planning on doing 2 and a half this year also. Mainly thanks to my wife we are in a better finacial position than I ever thought I would see. About 8 months ago I moved one of my retirement accounts to stable value and actually made a few bucks the last 2 quarters. Better to make a little than to lose alot like some of my friends did. I could retire and not lose much although my wife isn't too keen on that while she'll have too work . She's got a good job but it's not what you would call a typical arrangement as far as emplyee-employer relationships go.
Edited by KSauers 12/15/2008 7:51 PM
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Posts: 221
Location: Downers Grove, IL | Whether you have a job in the public sector or private, your nest egg has likely taken a BIG hit over the last year.
Mine certainly has and while I'm fortunate to work for a company that's actually bucking the trend and has been growing and adding jobs in the last year, my kids 529's and our 401k's and Roth's have gotten creamed!
Like others have said, I foresee 2009 (and perhaps well beyond) as a year of "getting by with what we have". I am as guilty as many Americans who have over the years, bought what I wanted, not what I necessarily needed. While I've been wise enough to do this without incurring debt (beyond our mortgage), American's penchant for excess and overextending themselves is not sustainable and clearly - we are all now paying for it.
Cash is king! I'll be squirreling away what I can and taking a hard look at what our family's needs are vs. our wants. In the long run, who knows, this change in spending habits may be a Godsend to my family and many others.
Now the hard part...actually sticking to it! |
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Posts: 512
Location: Appleton | The one common theme I see here is fear. I'm just as guilty as the next guy. I'm fearful for the future but at the same time I feel that if I pull back spending I just might help make the fear come true. We all know how trickle down economics work and if we all stop spending based on fear it leaves us in a much worse place. I just hope we all pull together during a tough time. |
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Location: Algonquin, ILL | I am holding off buying anything or making trip plans as they are talking about Layoff's here at work ,NO Work - NO Play 
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Location: Kenosha, Wi. | It will be very interesting how sales go while working the shows this year. I'm also lucky enough to work the private sector and in a secure job as no one else wants the night shift that I'm on. I could'nt get on the water much this past year because of the later hours but I'm grateful that I've got this job and my part-time job at Gander Mtn. I definitely won't be complaining this year if I can't get out much again. I'll just have to pick and choose my trips carefully this coming year. My 401k and stocks looked like they got mugged but am grateful that we were able to save some money like we have. We are ever so grateful for my military retirement right now as it is one thing that we are not taking for granted anymore. Our whole family has decided to only shop for the grandkids this Christmas and just get the family gathered together. I've put some money aside for the shows and will get fewer baits then in the past.
Edited by musky54 12/16/2008 8:49 AM
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Location: Ogden, Ut | I work for the state and have commented before about low pay, etc. Well, it's all relative. The worse the economy tanks, the better my salary and benefits look. Right now, it looks pretty good. I still get more leave time than I can use and my 401K is purchasing almost exactly twice as many stocks as it was a couple of years ago. Time is on my side there. When things turn around, those stocks purchased for a song will look pretty good. The Big 3 will be coming to me for a loan...LOL. That's the plan anyway.
S.
It's good to plan |
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Location: On my favorite lake! | The economy continues to get worse. Many 401K's are worth 1/2 of what they were and the majority of people and companies are cutting back. You may have a job today and not tommorow and every industry even government is being effected. I am still going to spend money on fishing but be more selective and put more money in savings. I can always spend it later. |
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Posts: 32
| Regarding the marine industry 2007 was their worst sales year since 1967. Keep in mind that in 1967 there were about 100 million fewer people living in the USA. So last years numbers were even more dramatic.
We had Thom Dammrich (the President of the National Marine Manufacturers Association) on our radio show and he said that the first quarter of 2008 was 40 percent lower than the previous year and at the end of 2008 they were expecting sales to continue to slow and decline.
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| I will definately travel less this year - Only four trips planned in 09 - week in Cabo San Lucas in Feb, week in Vail in March, 1 week on LOTW in July, and 1 week Minn. in Aug. - Sure wish this economy would pick up so I could get back to taking 2 months off!
Edited by IAJustin 12/16/2008 10:31 AM
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Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | This too shall pass. Recessions always do, although they hurt plenty of folks in the process.
I refuse to glorify the problems any worse than they have been already; instead I'll do my best to adjust to any shortfalls and move on. When I'm gone, counting the material things I had won't be as interesting for my friends and family left behind as counting the time we had together, so short answer is yes, I'm going fishing. I'll buy what I need to do so and enjoy it if I have the cash and adapt if I don't, and worry needlessly about the future only if it's announced there isn't going to be one for me. |
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Posts: 30
| Here is the closest thing to good news I have heard.
Our company just had a State of the Union meeting. If the economy goes as planned, we are staffed correctly for 09. Planning is a 15% sales drop in Q1, 8% Q2, 5% Q3 and 13% Q4. Anything worse than that and layoffs will follow.
I work for private, nonlisted company that could at this moment borrow over a billion dollars, has a put back rate of over 90% of profit, and has a base sales of necessity items that will never go away. We are picking up market share, even though sales were down 20% in 08 (40%+ for our competitors). We have a 3, 5 and 20 year plan in place and adjust to meet the 20 yr plan.
I will be spending some money on fishing, but most of it will go to ice fishing equipment. If I find the right deal on a boat, I might pull the trigger, but it would have to be one hell of a deal.
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| sworrall - 12/16/2008 1:22 PM
...When I'm gone, counting the material things I had won't be as interesting for my friends and family left behind as counting the time we had together, so short answer is yes, I'm going fishing....
Words of wisdom right there.
And yes, I'm certainly going fishing as well. I might not go as far or as often, but I'm going.
Edited by esoxaddict 12/16/2008 1:37 PM
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Location: Oregon | As spring approaches I expect things will slowly start to turn around. However, our country has a massive debt now and recovery will not occur over night.
I think the other thing that hurts is all the media continually pounding us with bad news, "our econony is bad, we are losing jobs, our debt is growing, we are doomed!!! " I know alot of people are out of work and losing money on investments but the vast majority of people are still gainfully employed, still driving SUV's, boats, using cell phones, etc. If the media would start telling people tomorrow that the recession is over and things are getting better it would make a huge difference.
I flew to the midwest last week and every single flight I was on was absolutely packed with people. While waiting at various airports, I noticed that every single person including all the kids was either on an Ipod, a cell phone, a laptop, or some othere similar electronic device. People aren't hurting yet..............we are still living very well.
Jed
Edited by RiverMan 12/16/2008 2:07 PM
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Location: Twin Cities | RiverMan - 12/16/2008 4:02 AMAs spring approaches I expect things will slowly start to turn around.
Jed, i'm curious what makes you think that? I've heard and read a lot of the opposite thoughts, it'd be nice to have or know a reason to think otherwise. =)
To the topic at hand, I will definitely be going fishing and hopefully buying a boat next year.
-Jeff
Edited by JRedig 12/16/2008 2:16 PM
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Location: minocqua, wi. | i work in the petrochemicals business and we are driven directly by the oil/natural gas commodities ... we saw our feedstocks hit all-time record highs in september and october which of-course we all felt throughout the rise in our consumer-wallets in the form of high fuel prices. my sector cracks natural gas and is sometimes also indexed off of the crude-refined commodity (whichever the crooks we call oil companies decide they can leverage) ... the end of this month will mark an equal and opposite "low" for these products. we're looking for stability to come back to the markets by the end of the first quarter but with a much smaller number of orders due to the shrinkage that's hit the markets in general. our company is planning a 3% increase on tonnage over last year so essentially flat against the falling market so not really any "growth" out of the economy. our end products touch almost everything that would index this economy and it's shrunk in a way that will last a little while ... telling me that consumers made some tough choices that will change buying habits long-term ... that's not so terrible ... because part of that it the pull-back of excesses that were so "normal". i look to the needs-based markets to rebound and regain strength, but on the novelties and want side there will be a lasting mark left ... the "correction" corrected a lot of people who will remember it and not make the same choices twice ... |
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| Sled, does that mean ETF's were a good choice after all? |
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Location: Oregon | JRedig - 12/16/2008 2:15 PM
Jed, i'm curious what makes you think that? I've heard and read a lot of the opposite thoughts, it'd be nice to have or know a reason to think otherwise. =)
-Jeff
I say this for a couple of reasons. One is that good weather changes peoples attitudes, people feel better about life as the weather gets better. The other is that better weather brings more work, construction picks up, farms start going, etc. And finally, many economists that are studying this down cycle say that if you look at past cycles we can expect this one to start turning around in May of next year.
Jed |
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| I work one of the big chemical co's and our situation for the product we produce is a sold out business.We are working 24/7 with overtime every day if wanted.We produce a polymar based plastic film called Tedlar,end use solar cells.The worse the economy,the more film they want.My problem this year has been having time off to go fishing.The other big product produced at our plant is Corian,being used in the building industry those sales are almost at a total stall.They will layoff from 45 to 55 workers very soon,this will go through both products due to union seniority.I'm lucky I have 33 years service and I'm in the top 30 out of 729 people as well.For me getting time off in 2009 will be a problem.Next door at the GM Powertrain over 2500 workers are on layoff.Accross the street Goodyear Tire just layed off 100 workers and cut back to two shifts.My charter fishing client bookings were down as much as 1/3 this year as well.Overall I will still be taking vacations as normal,I have found Costa Rica to be much cheaper this year,thats in mt favor.We still have the highest price of gasoline in all of the U.S. here in Buffalo,NY,$2.94!
Capt. Larry D. Jones
www.mostlymuskies.com/reports.htm |
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Location: Verona, WI | It's weird how the economy can hit you though when you least expect it. I have good, steady job and my wife is a nurse and could work anywhere. We bought a new house last year when mortgage rates were 6.25% with an 80/10/10 loan and were set to refinance at 5.25%. Guess what? The appraiser came through and the housing market has declined so much that I no longer had the 10% equity and had to make that money up out of my savings account. A lot of people would not be in the same position to be able to make up the difference.
Shane
Edited by ShaneW 12/17/2008 3:09 PM
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| LarryJones - 12/17/2008 1:40 PM
,I have found Costa Rica to be much cheaper this year,thats in mt favor.Capt. Larry D. Jones
www.mostlymuskies.com/reports.htm
Costa Rica rocks!! If anyone is looking to get away from the cold this year - Its hard to beat Costa Rica and the amazing #'s of sailfish. I'm doing Cabo this year instead - the marlin bite has been hot...hope its stays that way in Feb.!!! |
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Location: Warrenville,IL | I'll put my 2 cents in this way. We are putting ANY muskie on the wall now for $75. And even at THAT price we still have time to do other jobs.
Times are tough all over. Weather the storm and in a couple years we're all gonna be doing good again. We have no other choice. |
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Location: Land of the Musky | Just found out today that no raises will be given this year. That was good news to me! I thought it was going to be worse. Heck, I would even vote for a 10% pay cut if I knew the alternative was to fire 10% of the workers. (If that is what it came down to). Best Buy in MN is doing very bad right now too.
Plus its colder than crap here!
Here is how you know its COLD in Minnesota. Your pet deer just stands there all day long...
Edited by tacklebooty 12/17/2008 7:58 PM
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Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Santa is going to be PISSED! |
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| Well I hope Exxon Mobile and the other producers are getting fatter and fatter on the big ol steaks and lobsters they are eating. They made their money when they could and now that we are in the dumps im sure they really dont give a rats heinder!
Mr Musky |
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Location: East Troy, WI | yeah the way the economy is... its hard to justify spending 20-30 bucks on a lure come "show" time...
for all you guys who haven't found X-mas gifts for the kids.... KB toys (all 160 of them) are closing... everything is 30% off in store right now...
Edited by kreegz 12/17/2008 10:54 PM
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| tacklebooty - 12/17/2008 7:57 PM
Here is how you know its COLD in Minnesota. Your pet deer just stands there all day long...
He's looking a little skinny, maybe you ought to buy a few bags of corn for him? |
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Location: Greenfield, WI | I chose to fish and hunt as much or more than I ever had.
My Mom had called me just before Memorial Day Weekend to ask me, what she thought was an obvious question and answer, "You aren't really still going up north fishing with gas prices over $4/gal, are you?"
My instant response was, "Absolutely! I don't plan on standing at the pearly gates of Heaven declaring that I saved $20 on gas instead of spending a weekend on the water with my son and friends! Absolutely I'm going!"
What happens if gas is $5 next year, or $6 the year after that? Would that mean I stay home three years in a row? You don't get that time back! I'm having to make adjustments just like everyone else, but I'm still living my life to its fullest as long as I am able! |
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| guys you are correct. if your fortunate to cover the bills enjoy life within your means. if i could not fish i would be even nuttier.. some folks go to the bar, some to shows. i choose to fish. |
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