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Posts: 512
| Hey Guys,
Don't know if this is the right forum to post this question but figured it made sense.
I was wondering if anyone has tried any of the other auction sites such as stormpay, onlineauction, webidz, ebid.net, for example?
It seems that eBay is continually trying to force users to upgrade PayPal accounts and such in an effort to gouge for more money.
Just wondering what other fishermen opinions / experiences have been, etc.
Regards,
tmag |
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Posts: 389
Location: Corning, Iowa | I don't know what you're selling, but you have alot of options here. |
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Posts: 1270
| Plus Ebay is about as anti-gun and anti-hunting as they come and I assume that most of us fishermen are concerned about those issues as well. |
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Posts: 4053
Location: Land of the Musky | I am a heavy eBay user and really there is no one else around that you can get the amount of visibility (AKA Bidders) on your stuff. I do hate the fees though and it kills my S/H fees and make it look like your trying to make money off of shipping. Between eBay and PayPal I pay over 15% fees of my gross sales amount on average. They have some real nice hidden fees you never notice. If you items sell for an average $100 or more (example) then your fees are below 15% on average. It is the small guy/auctions they get you on (98% of the sellers). Competition will take eBay out soon once another company figures out the "widget" that works for people and pulls the bidders away from eBay. Until then most sellers are stuck...
I bet if Muskies First started a bidding site you would see at least 50% of the muskie/pike lures, terminal tackle, reels, rods, etc come off of eBay. JMO but I would love to see a fishing "MUSKeBay" here.  I think Steve would need to hire about 20 more employees though and I could not imagine the head aches running an auction site...
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Posts: 676
Location: Wisconsin | Anti-Hunting, Anti-Gun???
How so? Just because you can't sell a gun on there? I would hate to deal with that also, but it doesn't mean I am anti-gun, but leave that up to the experts at 4473's and FFL transfers.
Explain? |
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Posts: 512
| Hey Guys,
To answer the first question regarding "what I'm selling". I'm not actually selling anything it's just that I seldom use eBay to sell and over the past year they've become very agressive about pushing me into an upgraded PayPal account that charges monthly fees under the guise that I'm running an online store which I'm not.
Hence, that one response about pulling folks away from eBay was what I was looking for. A few seem to have some moderate business but eBay clearly is the giant and the fees are ruining it for me too.
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Posts: 1288
Location: WI | Ebay runs Paypal and if you're caught buying or selling guns or gun parts using PP, they will lock or delete your PP account. PP has people searching gunbroker.com looking just for that.
If selling firearms stuff I stick to the Equipment Exchange (free) on ar15.com, ebay is for all of my misc items. MH and this M1st both seem like great places to buy/sell fishing gear, although I seem to only be buying. 
Muskiemetal - 4/4/2008 12:11 PM
Anti-Hunting, Anti-Gun???
How so? Just because you can't sell a gun on there? I would hate to deal with that also, but it doesn't mean I am anti-gun, but leave that up to the experts at 4473's and FFL transfers.
Explain? |
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Posts: 676
Location: Wisconsin | I don't think Ebay is anti-hunting per se, it is just a tough thing to be in with guns and parts. I think everything else is good to go on there. I buy some Archery equipment on ebay. You just have to filter out all the crap on there. Lately, seems that things aren't really a good deal, factor in the insanely high shipping fees some impose to counter a low bid or reserve price. I have shipped a ton on ebay and I will tell you it isn't 15 bucks to ship a bow sight from Minnesota to wisconsin.
caveat emptor |
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Posts: 109
| I am a "Regular" Seller AND Buyer on e-bay.
As far as the gun issue... look at it from ALL angles. Not all interested parties are buying for hunting. There are LOTS of Gun web sites... like GunBroker.com and they are much better suited for firearms then e-bay.
Now, as far as E-bay, it is way better today then it was even 6 months ago with "fraud", etc. There was a lot of trouble at one time but "much" of it has been eliminated but you still need to use COMMON SENSE!
Edited by MoMuskieguy 4/4/2008 6:49 PM
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Posts: 1270
| They do not allow guns or any part of a gun that allows the gun to be fired such as triggers, bolts, ets. The reason they stted was that these items may present legal issues to Ebay if they get used in a crime BS! They sell cars on there, what if a guy buys a car off of Ebay and then buys some wine off of Ebay and then gets in an accident and kills someone? Is Ebay responsible? Heck No! Just the same as if the gun was used in a crime.
As for the FFL and 4473 that is between the buyer and the seller, Ebay has nothing to do with it. |
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Posts: 676
Location: Wisconsin | Wrong, If Ebay became an FFL they couldn't just send you the gun. They would have to send it to a FFL and that FFL would have to perform the 4473 paperwork and transfer the gun to you. |
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Posts: 910
Location: Hastings, mn, 55033 | "They sell cars on there, what if a guy buys a car off of Ebay and then buys some wine off of Ebay and then gets in an accident and kills someone? Is Ebay responsible? Heck No! Just the same as if the gun was used in a crime."
Maybe the thing is we have yet to see a major lawsuit brought against car manufacturers and dealers, so they probably arent to worried about being sued for facilitating the sale fo an automobile, where as facilitating the sale of a firearm used in a crime, especially if it happened to be STOLEN would cause problems for them.
Just think of how much time would need to be put in if they allowed guns & certain parts on ebay just tracking and verifying that they werent stolen firearms. And from my somewhat limited understanding of federal firearms laws(I could be wrong here) is that its against the law to even unknowingly sell a stolen firearm.
Edited by castmaster 4/5/2008 8:37 AM
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Posts: 1270
| It's against the law to sell any stolen product whether you know it's stolen or not. Most of the time I would assume that the authorities look the other way if it's not intentional though. How much time does Ebay use now to track down and find out if all the items there are stolen? I doubt hardly any. There was a post on MF a month or so ago about catching guys who were ripping of boaters in GB because they were sold on Ebay.
Ebay never takes possesion of anything so they would not need a FFL. FYI you do not need an FFL if you are sending a long gun to someone in the same state as you are. |
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Posts: 512
| Hey Guys,
Just in an effort to re-direct back to the original question, do any of you use, plan to use, have used, like, etc. any of the eBay alternatives out there.
It seems that a couple of the answers generally recommend to auction / trade specific sites (i.e. sites dedicated to a particular market niche or such).
As for the gun issue, it is an interesting dialogue that has opened here and one that I never would've thought of. When I think guns, I just generally think 'gun dealer' as I would like to see the item, talk about, etc.
Perhaps we should spin the eBay and gun question into its own separate thread?
Thoughts?
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Posts: 4053
Location: Land of the Musky | No-Not until I see a site that has the amount of users eBay does. Without users you won't get many bids and you will loss a lot more than the fees on eBay.
Again, if M1 had a bidding site they would get about half of my business to start with I load about 100-200 items on a week with eBay. Not all fishing but most are.
JMO,
James |
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Posts: 910
Location: Hastings, mn, 55033 | A little off topic, but is anybody else tired of what ebay has become? It used to be you cvould find some good deals on well kept used equipment. Now it seems like 80% or more of the posts are from guys using ebay as a business. heck the clowns who use the pink/purplish colored border around their gallery pics have over 1000 out of 1850 post for "musky,muskie" and HARDLY ANY EVEN HAVE BIDS OR GET BIDS!!! Thats over 50% of the items for a musky search taken by one seller, why not just open a store or figure out another way to do business so folks looking for decent prices on new or used equipment dont have to sort through THOUSANDS of posts for the same stuff by the same sellers!
Just really frustrating!! |
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| A little off topic, but is anybody else tired of what ebay has become? It used to be you cvould find some good deals on well kept used equipment. Now it seems like 80% or more of the posts are from guys using ebay as a business.
if there's money to be made, people are going to try and make it. this includes both the sellers you refer to and eBay itself. more listings, more buyers, more business all add up to more income for them. it is what it is, and outlets for less expensive products benefits everyone as an alternative to the big box stores.
at the same time, this is also why MuskieFirst has remained committed to keeping our own buy/sell/trade forum as a place to find used or second-hand new products and not a storefront for companies to sell their stuff. if it exists in muskie fishing, it'll come up for sale in that forum.
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Posts: 144
| I just bought a pair of factory grips for my colt python on ebay. There is some gun stuff on there. Just no guns. |
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Posts: 507
| We would build an auction site for our users if I thought it could work. The only problem is, can anyone cite an industry-specific auction site that has actually succeeded ? Convince us and we'll do it. |
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Posts: 4053
Location: Land of the Musky | castmaster-eBay needs an ignore feature... I know the seller you are talking about. Everything for $0.01 and $20 S/H. If I could add him to an ignore list I would in a second as it would clean up a lot of my eBay searches. On another note, it is fun to watch some of the other lures go off. A few basement builders here have lures on eBay and the one of a kind customs they make are outstanding workmanship and quality. They have gotten a fair share of my money ;/ I think without eBay you would never find their website(s) as they would just be 1 of 500,000 website when you search "muskie lure" on Google. For many, eBay is the only way. A few websites have a good following like Rollie, Thorne, Musky Tackle Online and a few select others but most are adrift in the sea of the Google servers never to be found by potential buyers... As I have told many, if you own an internet business, you will live and die by your Google/search results.... Even if you get good results you still may never get many sales....
JMO,
James
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Location: Hastings, mn, 55033 | James,
I agree 100% when it comes to the basement bait guys, for folks turning out HANDCRAFTED small batch lures it is the easiest way to get their name and product out to the most eyes.
"if there's money to be made, people are going to try and make it".....Thats just it, the specific seller I referenced has over 1000 items listed that come up when you search (musky, muskie) and a handful at most actually have bids. When you start auctions at $.01 and get no bids TIME AND AGAIN maybe its time to stop flooding ebay with your auctions dont ya think?? It becomes a real pain in the a** to search through when 1 of every 2 or 3 auctions is from the same seller, heck I bet if you took away just 6 sellers(the one with the pink borders, the one who makes the cheesy "bucktails" with various celebrities, logos etc on the blade just to name 2) you'd see search #'s go back down to where a guy can actually sort through them.
Now I scroll through a page or two with pink border after pink border and I get tired and close it out. Sucks for the rest of the sellers whose items get lost in the flood of autcions by a handfull of sellers.
ISN"T THAT WHAT THEY CREATED EBAY STORES FOR????? |
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Posts: 910
Location: Hastings, mn, 55033 | Lambeau I'll have to give that a try. I usually like to sort by newly listed items, that way I dont have to spend time sorting through things I've already looked at, just scroll down until i hit an item that was on the last time I searched and I know I've seen it all! |
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Posts: 4053
Location: Land of the Musky | I sort by the least amount of time. I have picked up a few good deals that way. I did try the above and you bet!!! Mr 1000 at $0.01 with $20 S/H goes right to the bottom of the list. LOL |
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Posts: 282
Location: north west wisconsin | you could try craigslist but its not an auction site, i have sold some stuff on there |
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Posts: 910
Location: Hastings, mn, 55033 | "I sort by the least amount of time. I have picked up a few good deals that way."
That works, but you'll miss out on items that had "Buy It Now" prices and were scooped up long before they ever get to the end of the auction. i've got some of my best finds on hard to find lures using buy it now. Many of them I am quite sure would have went for higher bids had the auction ran its course. I have also been able to work out trade deals with other collectors by seeing thier item before anyone else had bid on it. Tough to do that when looking at the auctions that are about to end instead of hte ones that have just been listed.
Looked at or friend this morning....623 items for auction, a whopping total of 3 HAVE BIDS!!!! I dont see how it can be cost effective to take the time to post 500+ or 1000+ auctions to only sell a half dozen of them! |
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Posts: 676
Location: Wisconsin | When I worked in Retail, we had a guy who would come in a buy a ton of clearance lures (storm's at 2.97). He would buy around 100 of them at that price no discount. I noticed that he posted them on ebay for about 3.25 to 3.5 each. He also paid sales tax on those lures which was even more stupid, but he must have been making about a couple of cents each lure. But he would show up every couple of months and buy another set.
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Posts: 4053
Location: Land of the Musky | Funny you mention that. I have had some items that I was shocked because tehy were bid up so fast on day 7! I figured some have thier eBay setup to look at the revered time period (oldest to newest). LOL about mr $0.01 with $20 shipping!!! He must spend a crap load on listing fees and with sales like that he must not do very well. eBay is a tough place to play. |
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Posts: 676
Location: Wisconsin | The reason for the .01 and 20 shipping is I think ebay charges you fees based on the selling price of the item. So for .01 the fee would be the lowest vs. 20 bucks. He is avoiding the fee structure. Someone could point that out to Ebay and he could get pulled.
Also, you have to watch out on Ebay about your business. If you operate a sales retail outlet on Ebay and do not collect sales tax (WI for WI resisdents) and don't report income to the state or feds (637, etc), you could be in a world of trouble.
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Posts: 4053
Location: Land of the Musky | Muskiemetal-It is coming (IRS). I sat next to an agent on a flight a few months ago. He is involved in higher level$$ investigations but I did ask him about eBay. He told me things were coming soon for eBay and PayPal. Of course he would though As for any "illegal" activity dealing with IRS or FET actions….. You can always call your IRS local agent and report those you feel may not be doing things correctly. If they get busted you can actually receive a large % of the fines collected. I keep my house (aka business) very clean as I know for a fact they will come a knocking someday.... I have heard of lure companies turning each other into the IRS in the past as well as the FTC (not properly labeling product of origin (aka China lures)). I have still notice one of my major competitions lure lines does not label their baits "Made in China". ruff ruff... Oh well, I have better things to do than spend time on the phone/hold with the IRS and FTC....like spending time here better |
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Posts: 512
| Hey Guys,
In my "real life", I'm actually a software engineer. Consequently, I'm pretty good at searching and pretty good at filtering. Maybe most or all of you know these things and do these things, but here's a few tips:
-- Don't search for musky lures or pike lures; made even worse without quotes around the phrase; instead search for custom painted musky; no quotes; after that, check the checkbox for "Search Title and Description" and re-run the search... notice any difference?
-- For non-custom baits, you'll probably need the name of the bait (i.e. Depthraider, Cobb, Rapala, etc.)
-- On Google or Yahoo, try the following: +"custom painted" +musky
For those unfamiliar with quotes and pluses, etc. it basically means the search must look for that exact phrase in quotes and the plus sign means that all results must have it. Similarly, a minus sign means results must exclude.
-- Under the "Advanced Search" options on eBay, see the option to 'Include' or 'Exclude' items from a specific seller
-- Check out the 'Help' on Google and Yahoo, etc. and see some of the tips and tricks they mention for searching
All of the above may prove very helpful in terms of ridding yourselves of annoying results that you don't want while searching sites like eBay, etc.
For those unfamiliar, I hope that the above is helpful. For the others, I apologize for any redundancy
Best
T |
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Posts: 4053
Location: Land of the Musky | For the search: +"custom painted" +musky on eBay you won't find any new lures though or lures without "custom paint" in the title or description... I just did a search on musky lure and it looks like eBay has started its other plan of attach. You may notice now on a general search that not all items are coming up equally. In my last search Mr. $0.01 w/$20 shipping had a few auctions with 1-10 minutes left and he was on page 3 while the guy in the number one position had 3 hours left. I think they are now using a "relevance" search algorithm to filter and arrange searches. I had an email on this some time ago and thought they were not going to implement it. Looks like they did.
As for Google, I strongly suggest using the above: +"custom painted" +musky My website comes up #1 and #2
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Posts: 75
| Castmaster, I agree:
"heck the clowns who use the pink/purplish colored border around their gallery pics have over 1000 out of 1850 post for "musky,muskie"
What I have started to do on the search is limit the distance of the search. I think the person with all the adds is from the west coast. If I limit the search to 750 miles, I do not get those listings. I might miss out on some good sellers out west but it does save time looking at the listing I want to see. I can always do a search for the one or two people outside the 750 mile limit.
Hope this helps. |
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eBay Alternatives?