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Posts: 714
Location: Rhinelander, WI | I know there are over 4 pages of pros and cons of this issue, but if and when this new regulation takes affect how will it affect you.
With the poll I am trying to see how this will affect people on this board regarding money, because apparently that is how this was sold to the State Representatives. I.E. it will be good for tourism.
Thanks,
Nail A Pig!
Mike |
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Posts: 999
| Depending on the weather and how the spring goes if the musky's are ready I will start a week earlier then the normal opener. If it's a late cold spring then that will be a different story. I will not be targeting them the first weekend or two in May in the northern zone.
Mr Musky |
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Posts: 170
| I'll spend the same...no doubt, this time frame will still be carved out for getting my walleye fix at the cabin until late May/Early June rolls around when muskie fishing turns on. |
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Posts: 412
Location: Waukesha, WI | I usually hit the Eagle River area with a bunch of friends mid to late May. This is basically the only trip I fish to fill the frying pan with them. No skis. No change for me. |
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Posts: 691
Location: nationwide | I would be fishing regardless but if I am musky fishing I would probably burn more gas running to different areas.
So I guess I would spend more . . . . but not much.
Corey Meyer |
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Posts: 9
Location: Green Bay | Usually hit Eagle River for opening weekend. Mainly for eyes but won't pass up the new opportunity to get some shallow water skis if the eyes are slow.
Probably spend the same....(in case wife is reading) |
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Posts: 1996
Location: Pelican Lake/Three Lakes Chain | I will spend exactly the same. I will not take part in this early season, I will continue to do as I always have and either walleye fish or travel south. I am not in favor of this law, and especially not how it was passed. Enough has been said about that elsewhere however. |
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Posts: 2323
Location: Stevens Point, WI | I agree with Norm. I to will do the exact same. That time of the year is spent filling my freezer with Walleyes, seeing it doesn't get done much after Musky opener on Memorial weekend. I also am not in favor of this law, and how it was passed either. |
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Posts: 617
Location: Clintonville, WI | No change for me in any repsect, but it has nothing to do with the new C&R reg or how it was "sold" to the public.
For me, the simple fact is that I head south (WI) for that opener and try to get to the WI/MI border opener.........no need for me to fish WI north of Hwy 10 until the classic North opener. |
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| What is the new regulation? Is it WI opener N of hwy 10 will be opening May 2nd? Being from MN i will definetly spend more money as i will fish WI as much as possible till MN opens. Northern WI is a lot closer to Minneapolis than Southern WI lakes, makes it much easier and shorter driving time. This is awesome. |
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Location: Lake Tomahawk, WI | I'm in Vilas at that time anyway, so wouldn't be any more spending for me. During our walleye runs in May we usually catch muskies on jigs and redtails, and it would be nice to be able to finally have the muskie net along without fear of recieving a ticket for "targeting" muskies.
My opinion on the new law doesn't matter, but I too am not a fan of how it was brought about. However, I would like to see how many people would complain about the process had it been used to ban single hook rigs or get 50" size limits on the 28 designated trophy lakes up here. Everyone says they would, but I seriously doubt it.
JS |
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| Pretty much what Norm said. I will not be participating. Wont be any change from what I have been doing, I like having to focus on the waters south of 10 for a couple weeks or target the spiny carp up here. Gives me a chance to fish with friends I dont get to once the season starts and things get busy.
I think its a huge slap in the face to guys that have worked hard to get things done the right way? And I think you will see more of this in the future. Very sad indeed. |
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| I find it very sad, that some of the bigger names in Norther WI muskie fishing are planning on "not fishing" during this new season. Even if you don't like how it is passed, this is one of the greatest opportunities for education to transpire...there is not longer an question of, "if the fish is legal size, you can keep it", it is only a chance to teach people the proper way to release the fish. I would think a pamphlet on how to being included with the new regs would do wonders. There are a large amount of opportunities to teach CPR here to a crowd that normally would not listen and a super chance of having this type of cpr behavior leech into the regular fishing season...It seem like a great opportunity for the fishery is being passed up by hurt feelings and sense of pride....Ben |
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Posts: 999
| Ben , how is not fishing during this new season going to affect how these bigger names teach people CPR? They teach it all year long on the water and off. What is the crowd your referring to that normally would not listen? I dont see where the hurt feelings plays a part either. Who hurt our feelings? I dont get what your trying to say.
Mr Musky |
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| Mr Musky - 1/7/2008 7:52 PM
Ben , how is not fishing during this new season going to affect how these bigger names teach people CPR? They teach it all year long on the water and off. What is the crowd your referring to that normally would not listen? I dont see where the hurt feelings plays a part either. Who hurt our feelings? I dont get what your trying to say.
Mr Musky
I agree you did not get what I was saying. Clearly when you have a season that is only C&R, a new season at that, the opportunity to teach proper methods in conjunction with the launch of the new season is a huge marketing opportunity for C&R. Sure these guys teach C&R year round to clients and others who are open to it...not a hard sell. Here you are given a group that has to do it and the opportunity to teach people who otherwise would have no access to it or are old school...But not everybody gets it...lots of ego in the muskie community |
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Posts: 1996
Location: Pelican Lake/Three Lakes Chain | Ben,
Maybe some are more concerned about letting the muskies spawn unharassed than they are about teaching proper release techniques of a spawning musky. Remember, in northern Wisconsin most of our lakes are sustained via natural reproduction. It is not proven that fishing them during the spawn will hurt them, but logic says it surely can't help their spawning success.
I personally feel that I can teach more by NOT fishing them at all than I can by targeting these fish while they spawn.
Edited by nwild 1/7/2008 8:49 PM
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| nwild - 1/7/2008 8:47 PM
Ben,
Maybe some are more concerned about letting the muskies spawn unharassed than they are about teaching proper release techniques of a spawning musky. Remember, in northern Wisconsin most of our lakes are sustained via natural reproduction. It is not proven that fishing them during the spawn will hurt them, but logic says it surely can't help their spawning success.
I personally feel that I can teach more by NOT fishing them at all than I can by targeting these fish while they spawn.
It sounds to me like the law is going to pass or already has, so people are going to be fishing them. I don't want to sound mean, but the people you have a chance to educate won't care if you fish or not because they have no idea who you are...What does your boycott accomplish? Pretty much nothing and only hurts the fish further, because an education promotion via some of the guides in that area would enable those who do fish them to release them in great condition to spawn...but a boycott by someone that the general public has no idea about only hurts the opportunity to educate, it accomplishes nothing else.... |
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Posts: 1996
Location: Pelican Lake/Three Lakes Chain | And to turn that right around....maybe those general public people won't all of a sudden decide to musky fish just because it opened a month earlier.
And just maybe those that already musky fish and do know me and did see me fishing them might say..."well Norm's doing it, maybe its just fine."
Most of the people in the general fishing public will target walleye instead of musky that time of year, myself included.
Edited by nwild 1/7/2008 9:10 PM
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Posts: 999
| Ben, Just because there's an early catch and release season it doesnt' mean a whole "new" rookie group of individuals are going to be out there. There are people in the general publc that dont know how to handle muskys because they dont fish for them. These same people are surely not going to run out and book guides for this early season so I still dont get your point? The groups will still stay the same. We will be educating the public as we are doing on this board by letting the public know that we do NOT support the early season because we feel it is best to leave the musky's alone while they spawn. The same reason we leave the walleyes and northern pike alone while they spawn.
Mr Musky |
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| nwild - 1/7/2008 9:06 PM
And to turn that right around....maybe those general public people won't all of a sudden decide to musky fish just because it opened a month earlier.
And just maybe those that already musky fish and do know me and did see me fishing them might say..."well Norm's doing it, maybe its just fine."
Most of the people in the general fishing public will target walleye instead of musky that time of year, myself included.
Interesting logic, I don't live in WI and have not fished there in about 15 years and I know about the new C&R season so I think it will be very popular. I also think many people especially with higher gas prices will fish there instead of driving south for the earlier seasons...I guess we can only hope that everyone realizes that Norm is not fishing and that power shall carry over to the masses:) |
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Posts: 1996
Location: Pelican Lake/Three Lakes Chain | I really don't see your logic where anyone can help the fishery by targeting spawning fish. If I go on the water targeting muskies I intend to catch them, and I don't see how that is going to help spawning fish. Me not handling a bunch of spawning fish very well may help it.
I hope nobody notices that I wasn't there, largely because they weren't either.
Hopefully we won't have to worry about it, maybe something will be done before the spring of '09.
Edited by nwild 1/7/2008 9:20 PM
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Posts: 20183
Location: oswego, il | I won't be spending more, I usually don't head north untill the season opener anyway, I still fish down here. I agree with Norm and I base it off of tropical fish I used to have when I was a kid that were pregnant. The stress of capture and separation caused problems and dead young. |
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| I am not here to argue if it hurts the fish or not. I have my own ideas, but I will say that if you own a house on a muskie lake you are hurting them more than fishing for them during the spawn for the most part I think everyone will agree...I am just saying if it is a law and going to happen, better to make it positive and help the fishery rather than just be a dog chasing his tail.... |
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Posts: 1996
Location: Pelican Lake/Three Lakes Chain | Again, let me try to explain this. If I am handling an egg laden female there is no way I am helping the fishery in any way, shape or form. I am doing a far better service by not targeting these fish and not offering a guide service at this time.
Pelican lake is completely sustained through natural reproduction. We fought hard to get a 50" limit on that lake to protect these larger spawning females. How on God's green earth would I be helping the fishery by hooking, fighting, and releasing these fish during the spawning season. It would seem just a touch hypocrytical for me to hire myself out to target these fish.
Sometimes the best teaching is done by example. |
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Posts: 734
Location: Watertown, MN | Mike
Spend the same, Ben people would still head south, good fisheries with warmer water temps, and more active fish. Pending the weather fishing muskies in early may is going to be slow. Here is an interesting questions is how will this effect border waters like LVD and St Croix.
Troyz
Like Norm stated nothing good is coming out of this, beside potentially hurting the future of WI fisheries. I have not seen and real support from the DNR on this topics. May is for eyes and giving the in-laws a few fillets to actually prove that I do fish and catch something.
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Location: The Yahara Chain | The WI/ MI border lakes will not be affected by this. |
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| I'll likely fish all 3 weekends with kids on action lakes near Hayward. It's a great opportunity to get kids out fishing on these lakes where spawning is typically over and the WDNR is promoting harvest of Muskellunge - so I don't see a problem.
Gas, restaurants, new lures (barbless) and possibly an overnight stay or camping will be a sure thing.
I hope that people concerned with spawning Muskies on a lake like Pelican (for example) that is going to rely on NR will be working with the DNR to keep that particular lake closed to Musky fishing until Memorial day and not try to keep this fishing opportunity from the rest of us. Like 50" size limits the early season may not be the best thing for all lakes.
On a side note - the C&R season is a great precedent to have in place.
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| I dont think people realize that the majority of lakes in the effected area do have at least some natural reproduction going on. We are literally talking hundreds of lakes here. To try and deal with it on a lake by lake basis is just not realistic. Why take the chance? Not one biologist has said this is a good idea that I am aware of. Until I see biologist support for this, my opinion wont change. |
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| Shane, would you agree that most biologists will say that catching, handling and releasing muskies at ANY time of the year isnt too good for them? |
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| Peter, I am not aware of any biologists outside of PETA that are against catching fish at "any" time of the year. But common sense would tell you that this is probably correct.
But we arent talking about any time of the year, we are talking about during the spawn, on many naturally reproducing waters. |
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| Not one biologist has said this is a good idea that I am aware of. Until I see biologist support for this, my opinion wont change.
-My question was more if biologists think that catching, photographing, and releasing fish is good for the fish. Your comment was that you didnt think that anyone could find a biologist that says that C&R before and during the spawn was good for the fishery, I guess my question is when is C&R actually good for the fishery?
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| I am referring to the process on how these things normally get done, part of it usually includes biologist support. In most cases, and especially one that I think should have applied here.
Instead some "tourism people" decided they knew what was best for the fish, decided they didnt need the usual biologist support to back their effort. They couldnt even pass it in their own county it smelled so bad. Apparently the majority of people up there got it.
When stuff like a season change gets done normally, there will be biologist input. There was none here. Ask the DNR how much input was requested from them on this early season, as far as I know outside the tourism dept. none that I have talked to.
Had this gone through the proper channels it would have had to had biologist support. We are dealing with a technicality in the Green Bay issue that was tossed out because our biologist moved and his position was vacant when this went through. Believe me I am familiar with biologist support. And the need to have one sign off on something like a size limit change.
So just because it got done the way it got done means I have to live with it, now I, and others are called out for not being there to educate people on how to deal with it.
I think Norm pretty much covered here
"Again, let me try to explain this. If I am handling an egg laden female there is no way I am helping the fishery in any way, shape or form. I am doing a far better service by not targeting these fish and not offering a guide service at this time."
Minnesota biologists decide whats best for naturally reproducing waters CLOSED season during the spawn.
Canada biologists decide whats best for naturally reproducing waters CLOSED season during the spawn.
Then I have to look at Wisconsin.
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Posts: 714
Location: Rhinelander, WI | Great responses, thanks. Looks like I was wrong with my assumption on the other thread as based on this poll of die hard musky fishermen there appears there will be almost a 15% increase in the number of people spending money north of Hwy 10 in this time frame.
Ben, I think I understand where you where coming from in your exchange with Norm. I will try and sum it up, as I see it. There will be a number of musky fishermen that currently DO NOT practice catch and release that as a result of this will want to fish musky in May. As a result they will be forced to practice C&R and just maybe that experience will spill over into the rest of the season, thus turning a catch and keep musky fisherman into a catch and release fisherman. Maybe once they see one of those bad boys swim away they will get the trill of it, maybe not.
Norm, I also understand your position, and it makes total sense.
Not having the benefit of being able to fish any time I want, I will base my decision on to fish or not to fish based on the conditions present each year. If the spawn is over I will most likely cast for musky when given the chance. But, now I have to play the roll of personal biologist to determine if the fish are done spawning, that doesn’t seem like a very good idea when you consider everyone now has to choose for themselves. Most will just fish and not worry about it, because that’s what we pay the biologists for, and since they changed the reg. it must be OK. RIGHT? 99% of fishermen will look at it that way, as most have no clue how the regulations are written.
Peter PotStirer, The way I believe you are looking at it, Catch and Release fishing is almost always better than the other option. Which is Catch and Kill fishing. The only time C&K is better is when keeping fish is encouraged because of overpopulation.
Nail A Pig!
Mike |
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| MR, I am not only speaking of the muskie fishermen...I speaking of your walleye guys and other fishermen. Now that there is a "special" season...your weekend fisherman can be educated on how to handle muskie because there is a special season now. Those guys who don't fish musky and may catch one now and then could for sure be educated on how to handle them with a promo release in conjunction with the new season. Muskie fishermen that are old school are becoming a thing of the past, but the weekend warrior still will keep one or just not know how to release them as we have all seen. This is a great opportunity to really educate the non muskie fishing community...very rare chance to hit the folks that have the largest impact on kept muskie in my opinion... |
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Posts: 929
Location: Rhinelander. | Is there any data on any of the lakes north of hwy 10 on the muskie population befor the season was closed in may and up to last year. Would like to see if d.n.r. creel counts on those lakes improved with the season closed all those years. Did numbers increase,stay the same or go down. I have mixed felings on this but know that may was always a very good for me and I did not fish spawning areas. Its the time of the year where small live bait works really well and it has yielded so many multiple fish days for me. Usually occurs the last two weekends of may. I really can't recall that over that time we ever got even 1 musky that had eggs in it. We also never got any really big fish but had alot of fun, thats what fishing is about to me. We use lighter tackle and its a riot. The water is cool yet and all fish seemed returned in very good shape.
Now let me see some of you think we should give up sucker fishing.
Not fish much in july and august as its too hot and fish don't release well.
Don't fish in november because its too clod and fish harder to release in good
condition.
Now don't fish in May as fish are spawing.
Gee whats left?
I think as mentioned early if your going to fish in may stay out of the know spawning areas. We all know where they are on the lakes we fish so it should be easy to stay clear of them.
Pfeiff |
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Posts: 32813
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | I will not be fishing Muskie mostly because I'll be on the road.
I'm one of the folks old enough to have fished quite a few years when Muskie opened the first Saturday in May. I can remember two years when the fish were spawning. Most years the fish are done.
Fishing for them pre-spawn will be a very rare occurrence. Facts are the season will be open, and we will all, like Mike said, have to make a decision based on if the fish are done spawning or not. Easier to just not mess with it unless I target lakes with no natural reproduction. I won't, but I hope a few folks who will fish an early and cold Spring make that choice.
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Posts: 54
| as stated before if it goes through and is put in the books on 2009, i will not be guiding north of hwy. 10 with the open season lake as an exception.
i sincerely hope it gets overturned.
if sound biology proves my gut feeling wrong then i would possibly change my mind.
i was and am VERY dissapointed in the people that got congressman meyer to push this through for their own selfish(money greedy) needs. seems to me all they are worried about is the almighty dollar.
i'll probly head south to chase em in the warmer water like i always have.
dannyboy
dannyboys guide service
musky crazy
laona,wi
715-674-2061
[email protected]
[email protected]
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Posts: 101
Location: mn | Why teach cpr on spawning fish, that sounds silly to me. Not all fish spawn at the same time. Even with cpr, alot of fish will die. Why take the chance of killing a spawner. The walleye fishing is great this time of year. I see alot of guys claiming there bass fishing but really catching muskies before opener in metro mn and it bugs the crap out of me. Tips will be on speed dial this year so watch out metro guys. WI resources are fragile enough as is. It makes no sence to me!! |
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Posts: 8732
| We're talking about a period of a few days where during some years the spawn might not be through on opening day.
I don't see people flocking to Northern Wisconsin in lrge numbers to chase muskies for the opener, and I would expect pressure during the week to be close to none. I would also hope the locals and any serious musky anglers would wait to fish these areas until the water warms up regardless of whether it is legal to fish during that time.
I think the way this new law came to be sucks, and I think the law itself is kind of pointless. But I still don't see it having much of a negative impact, especially since the people who are serious about muskie fishing will probably head South in search of more active fish and warmer water. |
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| Honest question: Is there any study-based evidence that fishing during the spawn hurts fish or populations? I understand the so-called "common sense" argument, but is there any real evidence out there? Thanks. |
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Posts: 16632
Location: The desert | I'm not for this whole new law, but I also dont think its as huge an issue as we're making it. There is place here on the WI river where I can go and see lots of big spawners before the southern season opens. I've seen lots of people toss jigs and little cranks at them....most are hardly interested in their offerings. I've seen several caught also, and released a few for people who didnt have a clue what to do with them and they've all gone off strong and I've watched them rejoin the packs. I think that if people who are die hard musky guys who know how to properly CPR a fish go and fish the new open season it wont be a big deal. I also dont envision every boat owning person in the state of WI flocking up north to turn the water to a froth tossing at spawning fish. To be honest, I bet there are some average Joe's who wont even know about this new regulation. That said I make no plans to fish it, better water south of HWY 10 anyways! |
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Posts: 154
Location: Appleton, WI | Article on a study on LMB. Fish were simulated to be tournament handled during spawning. To make a long story short, the fish that were subject to the simulated tournament catch there fry were later to show up and were smaller and lighter than non- stressed fish. Check it out in the Feb issue. Just some more food for thought.
Edited by Esox chaser 1/13/2008 5:09 PM
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Posts: 686
Location: Tomahawk, Wisconsin | As for me, I'm going fishing, north or south, release em all anyway, I remember fishing for muskies on opening day north of Hwy.10 way back when.................. the muskie nazis are among us!! |
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| 3-words for you at that time of year: Sturgeon Bay Smallies! |
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| Im from IL so for me why would I want to go north to fight with spawning fish when my fish are done. For me geting fish when ther spawning is very very tuff. I can pick off the males but the big females are allmost imposible to get to react. The only way I would go is if we have a warm spring and the fish are done spawning. |
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Posts: 1449
Location: Kronenwetter, WI | How many of you who will not fish the northern opener to avoid the spawn also deliberately do not fish the boundry waters for the same reason...I know it's two weeks later, but those waters are also alot further north than HWY 10. |
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Posts: 32813
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Consider:
The fish in most if not all the waters up here are done spawning on an average year by the fishing opener. Avoiding spawning fish that time of the year should be easy if it isn't a very cold spring. There are over a dozn lakes up here that are maintained totally by stocking, so those would also be a choice. |
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As a result of the new C&R Musky Season North of Hwy 10 I will…