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Posts: 367
Location: Chicago | This will be very interesting. I am quite surprised that the DNR is doing this.
Here is an article that was printed in the Chicago Sun Times today:
Buzz at Busse: Muskies
IDNR will stock lake today with 800, but questions remain
September 12, 2007
BY DALE BOWMAN Staff Reporter
I'm not alone in wondering if the first official stocking of muskies in a Forest Preserve District of Cook County lake is a net gain.
Illinois Department of Natural Resources hatchery staff will make history today by stocking 800 12- to 14-inch muskies in the main pool of Busse Lake in the near northwest suburbs.
Muskellunge are a top predator in northern waters and occasionally reach 40 pounds in Illinois.
The muskie stocking was the brainchild of district superintendent Steven Bylina Jr., notorious for his outdoor pursuits. He wanted fishermen to have an opportunity to catch the most fabled northern fish nearby.
''I'm actually on the fence on the idea of stocking Busse with muskies,'' e-mailed Zach Arnold, president of the Chicagoland Muskie Hunters. ''Pro -- fishing for muskie in near northwest Cook County!''
His three ''cons'' were the relative shallowness of Busse (maximum depth of 14 feet) and needs for a retention net and angler education on handling muskies.
That's probably my greatest concern. I think Illinois has gone overboard dumping muskies into too many bodies of water where ordinary fishermen are ill-equipped to handle the shock of catching a large toothy muskie.
Muskie fishermen, like the fish they pursue, make up a special group. They're more often Type A personalities or compulsive sorts than any other sportsmen. Pursuit of muskies often becomes a quest that borders on an addiction. For them, handling muskies becomes second nature; not true for most fishermen.
Normally, I would consider Busse a perfect example of muskie mania run amuck in Illinois. Except, I think it provides a unique test case.
Fisheries biologist Jim Phillips said Busse's main lake will receive the muskie stockings while the south pool will continue with stockings of northern pike, another top toothy predator.
''I like the idea of being able to have a control group,'' Phillips said.
My second question is whether muskies will survive the pressure at the most heavily fished water in the forest-preserve system long enough to reach a decent size. Biologists will track that through identification chips, planted in 200 muskies from the initial stocking. During surveys, biologists will record growth and overall health of the fish.
Another legitimate concern any time muskies are stocked in new water is the impact on smaller fish, especially the panfish most pursued at Busse. Phillips didn't think it would be a problem.
''Busse has a very healthy shad population and a healthy white sucker population,'' he said.
''On a selective basis, muskies can aid prey overpopulation and stunting, plus offer urban anglers a unique opportunity,'' said Ray Thompson, chairman of Illini Muskies Alliance, which supported a similar stocking at Mallard Lake in DuPage County in 2006. ''My biggest fear, personally, is that the size/creel limits will not be enforced effectively.''
That's very realistic.
The minimum length for muskies at Busse is 36 inches. Phillips thinks it will take three years for the first stocking to reach 36 inches. In many muskie waters in Illinois, the minimum length is 48 inches.
''We may have to re-evaluate the regulations in a couple years,'' he said.
On the fishing side, adding muskies alters the approach to other species. As muskies survive and grow, they displace other top predators, such as largemouth bass, from the best ambush spots like points and inside weed edges.
Fishing will change. Whether it's for better or worse at Busse, we'll have a couple of years to figure it out.
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| Wow, I remember fishing there one the first day it was open....should be good if they don't get frozen out...do they allow ice fishing there? |
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Posts: 367
Location: Chicago | Good question, as I have not fished it in better than 15 years. It will be interesting. I don't know how smart it is to stock nothern's at the same time even though it is in a different lake. |
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Posts: 305
Location: Illinois | Yes, they allow ice fishing on Busse in the Main and South pool but not in the North pool. |
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| is the main lake where the sail boats are? aren't they connected? I don't live there any longer but it is still pretty interesting... |
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Posts: 1245
Location: Madtown, WI | I bet they get cooked out....
14 feet deep....no room to hide from the summer heat.
interesting to see how they do.
Cory |
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Posts: 8863
| What nobody mentions is the fact that all the local lakes have a similar problem, that will be a problem here as well:
Complete disregard for the local fishing regulations. I suspect, as is the case everywhere I have fished down here (and I have fished them all) that certain segments of the population will keep every one they catch, and that's what will do the population in. Minimum length limits, creel limits, etc. mean nothing to these people. You cant revoke their fishing licenses because they don't have one, all you can do is run them off if and when you catch them.
On one hand I think its great -- muskies in my backyard!!!
But maintaining a successful fishery requires many things, none of which are present in the local forest preserve lakes. |
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Posts: 367
Location: Chicago | Bingo! EA captured my sentiments to the tee. |
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| It is an experiment a stones throw from my house, so it will be interesting to watch. 200 of the 800 will be tagged for tracking and we will see how many of those make it. We may be tracking lots of buckets leaving the lake Ha Ha |
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Posts: 8863
| Would be nice of the people carrying those 200 buckets were apprehended. Steve, you know what we're dealing with down here, what do you think the outlook for this kind of project is going to be? As stated above, I say fish soup before they reach 24". |
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Posts: 166
Location: Gurnee, Illinois | Will the identification chips activate a signal when layed on a grill?
Dave |
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| EA, You target muskies I assume? How many do you catch on an average trip? How many did you catch last year? the year before? Busse woods has always been a great fishery if you took the time to find the fish. The bank fisherfolks will always be there, but I doubt they will impact the muskies. They did not impact the bass or pike....Should be interesting to see how it works out, but muskies are just not that easy to catch especially if you are fishing on the bank....
Edited by BenR 9/13/2007 12:20 PM
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Posts: 8863
| You're comparing apples to oranges Ben. First off, bass are a lot more prolific than muskies. Wiping out a bass population is near impossible no matter how many you eat. Second of all, like most musky anglers, I fish with artificial lures, I release my fish, and I am only one person.
I would rather have 100 guys like me out there every weekend than have the groups of 10 fishing with live bait from shore, and keeping every fish they catch.
The local forest preserve lakes are fished HARD, morning, noon, and night. If the muskies are given a chance to grow to adulthood by conscientious anglers who understand how to successfully release a muskie, this program might have a chance. But I dont care where you fish, when muskies are taken out of the system nearly every time they are caught, it won't take long before there just aren't many left. |
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| How any acres in the area they are being stocked in? I don't think you want a large population. The seem to be putting a larger number than is required for the area. Also live bait on shore is not that easy. I have blanked numerous times with suckers from a boat over the years. The fox chain is a great fishery for muskies and half of the fish go down river as well as dealing with the same shore fishermen. I caught my first 50 from the chain in 1999 and has days of up to 11 fish. Wolf lake was a great tiger lake until they stopped stocking it and it gets a ton of pressure. Same with Pierce lake and that lake has been loaded with muskies for years. I actually caught a fingerling there in 77 or 78 when they first stocked it when I was 5 or 6 years of age...turned me into a muskie fisherman...Every example of muskies is high pressured IL lakes has turned out pretty well...the lack of depth might hurt, but I think your idea has no support from previous similar lakes.... |
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Posts: 8863
| Ben, you have blanked, I have blanked, we ALL have blanked. Even if we had 10 fish days every time out, we're still releasing them, and (hopefully) doing it in a way that ensures they will swim away and live.
My concerns are not the casual shoreline anglers who may stumble on one and put it back, my concerns are the folks who fish there day after day after day, and unless they are caught and forced to release their fish take home every single fish they catch. Combine that with the location of Busse, which unlike Pierce and the other lakes you mentioned is smack dab in the middle of an area where the people I am talking about live, and you know what's going to happen. I hope I'm wrong Ben, I really do. But judging by what I've seen over the last 30 years fishing all the forest preserve lakes in Cook and DuPage county, I am not very optomistic.
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Posts: 367
Location: Chicago | Ben I am not concerned about the person targeting muskies, but the incidental catch that will happen often, and not be released. Just as EA has said. |
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| Ben, I think you moved out of state before things got really bad out here with the people in question. Certain ethnic populations in the Chicagoland area have absolutely exploded in the last 5 years or so and this has had a dramatic effect on ALL fisheries in the area that are susceptible to shoreline pressure. The Fox Chain is not affected as much due to the fact the vast majority of the shoreline is private. But any body of water with ample shore access has had the quality of the average fishing experience reduced. You should see what has become of certain areas of the Fox River.....what a shame. Thanks again to the greatest Governeror of the new millenium, Rod R Blagoevich, for gutting a DNR staff when it's people needed it most....
I agree with the folks here, those fish are doomed due to the no release ethnic ethic. Furthermore, I'd have to be pretty desperate to fish Busse for musky anyway. If you ask me that place has always been kind of a dump.
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Posts: 305
Location: Illinois | Ben R. to answer your post awhile back; yes, Busse Main is the area with the sailboats. (and that is a good spot )
I predict the project will stock Salt Creek with muskies. I really don't think the muskies will die off from a lack of deep water as there is enough current running through Busse imo. There will be much more loss to the creek than from angling. I believe that in these situations it makes sense to have a closed season during the spawn. Since the spawn varies, the closed season might have to be more than a month. Even muskies that don't spawn successfully move shallow. (most anyway) Shallow muskies in a populated area with no closed season is asking for a problem from poachers, snaggers, buckets, gang bangers. What would the spillway on Wingra look like during the run if the season weren't closed?The DNR better make a reg now before next spring or there will be a problem.
Without a barrier, and a closed season, the project will probably struggle. Salt creek should be fun in about 10 years. |
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Posts: 20278
Location: oswego, il | This lake does get warm in the summer and it has alot of shallow water. It also has two spillways, one that created it and a mid lake one that connects two areas. Those spots are heavily fished and will be musky magnets. There are pike in busse and they are targeted. I guarentee there will be muskies caught and kept being confused for pike and lots of them. Probably not the best place to put them inho but time will tell. I think the creek will see alot of fish moving up and down and people catching muskies in the des plaines river and the hinsdale dam on salt creek. |
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| A closed season in IL? I don't think that would fly. |
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Posts: 1636
| woops forgot to log in |
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Posts: 305
Location: Illinois | I agree Brandyn, probably won't fly. Still, I think it's the only way to keep the snaggers from taget practice in spring. I am not talking about a statewide closed season but instead a closed season just for Buss and Mallard. |
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Posts: 1769
Location: Algonquin, ILL | You can write Laws and Regs until you fingers fall off but they won't do any good without enforcement, With all the cuts to the DNR there are just not enough Wardens to enforce the laws much less any new ones
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Posts: 108
Location: Crystal Lake,Illinois 60014 | FELLAS, I gotta agree with EA,Mossback,Reelwise,ToddM etc.., Its just not going to fly at all.
Whether its fish soup or just simple laziness to knowledge, people that make up the percentege that fish there just simply won't care their in there.
I have never like the place, to me its a dirty cesspool with mediocre fish.
I would be surpised if any pike(ooops..I mean Musky! lol) makes it over 24" before the grill.
Places like Lake Atwood(McHenry co.) would have been a good choice to experiment. Dnr and Ranger enforced, good depth, very clear and no live bait fishing, could be a future spot.
thanks guys
D. |
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Posts: 317
| Busse is alot more than a mudhole. Yes, it is shallow, but like any flowage, it gets current from the river. There is an enormous amount of forage like shad and suckers, and the Walleye population is rediculous. I catch more walleye than bass there, with the biggest pushing 30" I have seen bigger there too. The Bass seem healthy as well. Only a fraction of the shore is accessable to fishing, and there is alot of structure like rip rap, logs and trees, holes, bars, etc. I think Muskies will flourish in Busse.
The bucket people problem is severe though. I get dirty looks when I release walleye, and I even busted some immigrants with a gill net in the creek. I will not be ordering the fish special at local asian restaurants! I once saw some guys with 5 gal buckets full to the top with snails, and they told me they were good to eat. Gross.
Edited by MuskyStalker 9/14/2007 10:04 AM
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Posts: 1
| Hi All,
I came across this thread from 2007, when they began stocking Muskie in Busse, and thought it would be kinda cool to revive the thread with an update. It's interesting to me to see what was being said, predicted, etc. back then and what the reality is now.
Today, the Muskie are thriving in Busse. People catch them on a regular basis. Believe it or not, the most popular spot to fish them is on the Salt Creek side of the Main dam. There's an area that's pretty deep in Salt Creek that hold some killer Muskie and Walleye. People that fish there will probably do bad things to people who try to "harvest" a Muskie, legal or not  They are pretty passionate about preserving the Muskie fishing that has developed there.
A recent survey of the lake produced Muskie in excess of 37", which isn't bad. You can find the report by searching Google for "busse lake status summary". The largest I've seen was 31", which is still pretty good.
As a side note, Pike are only stocked in the South Pool (where the Muskie are not stocked). However, due to flooding the Pike have spilled over the South dam into the Main Pool. Also, "they" are planning to redo the Main dam to allow lowering the water level of the Main Pool just before a heavy rain to reduce Salt Creek flooding. Why don't they also dredge the Main Pool to make it deeper as well? Anyway, that's probably going to affect things quite a bit (in a bad way). We will see in the next few years what will happen.
That's all, folks! Happy Fishing!!!! |
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| Thanks. Time flys! |
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Posts: 1283
| Busse is a great lake that has a lot of Muskies and they are doing great along with ever other species. I know for a fact 2 within the last 2 days have been caught. I also caught a beautiful pike in the main lake earlier this year so they do escape the south pool. The creek is good for skis but the main lake is good too but you need a boat to hit the best spots. |
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Posts: 1767
Location: Lake Country, Wisconsin | a 31" musky is "pretty good"....? |
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Posts: 1283
| For Busse its not bad. A 34 was caught yesterday. |
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Posts: 1
| The fish that stay in the lake are fat and healthy... The creek is good as well but a fish barrier at the dam would be awesome... Also IMO, the south pool lake is Going to give up some pigs in the near future |
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Posts: 1283
| I agree with that! |
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Muskies in Busse Woods...?