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Posts: 227
Location: Southeast Wisconsin | No offense to any other boat manu. but I have to give MUCH love to my Ranger because she probably saved my life yesterday.
A buddy and I were fishing on okauchee yesterday and are lucky to be alive. We were fishing off one of the points in deep water when all of a sudden my concentration was broken by my buddy who had started screaming and waiving his hands. I instantly turned around to see a ski boat pulling a tuber and they were coming right at us. Even worse the lady driving, as well as everyone else in the boat were looking at the tuber. I also started screaming but the driver didnt respond. The ski boat didnt look like it was going to ride up the back of my boat, but was definitely going to hit us so I crouteched down, grabbed my rail, and got ready to jump out if neccasary. As the boat approached I made the decision to stay put just as she slammed into the side of my boat at 40 MPH! After the collison my focus was on my buddy who was missing from the boat. A few seconds later he popped up outta the water and climbed in the boat (he apparntly jumped outta the boat just before impact) The end result was 2 lost rods, a ripped off rod holder, ejected lowrance, bent rail and a 6x3' area of cracking in the gel coat along the side as well as numerous other scratches and dings. I smacked my knee pretty good and woke up this morning feeling like I got hit by a truck, but no major injurys were sustained by us or the other boat (thank god!!)
It could of been any other boat that came out of a similar situation with such little damage, but it just so happened that I was in a Ranger. And for that I will never own another boat for as long as I live..
Get yourself a LOUD! air horn and keep it handy...
If your retarted, please dont opperate a boat..LOL |
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Posts: 1270
| Glad to hear that everything turned out OK so far, at least as far as injuries. Sad to say but you might want to get a lawyer as it sounds like you have injuries along with a possiblly destroyed Ranger. I am not a sue type guy but this is one case where suing the living be-jesus out of her might help all of us if word gets around people might actually start driving boats with some caution. I doubt it but it might help. |
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Posts: 20281
Location: oswego, il | Wow, did they keep going or did they stop? I am glad everyoe is relatively ok, that could have been a disaster. I was in a boat collision when I was a young kid, my unlce stopped in front of us for whatever reason and my dad hit his stern full bore and we went up and over the back end of the boat. 4 of us and me and my brother were in the front bench seat blocking much of the view. My uncle luckily dove to the front of the boat. Luckily we were ok the lunds we bent a little and my uncles motor scracthed up, we were lucky. |
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Posts: 412
Location: Waukesha, WI | glad to hear everyone survived the experience. Sunday, hmmm. Distracted and/or inebriated? Hope the injuries are short lived and you can get back to fishin' |
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Posts: 2361
| reelman - 7/2/2007 10:39 PM
Glad to hear that everything turned out OK so far, at least as far as injuries. Sad to say but you might want to get a lawyer as it sounds like you have injuries along with a possiblly destroyed Ranger. I am not a sue type guy but this is one case where suing the living be-jesus out of her might help all of us if word gets around people might actually start driving boats with some caution. I doubt it but it might help.
I can't agree with your advice here. I am sure the driver of the other boat was even more freaked than the guys that saw it coming. Reelman said the injuries were not serious. There should be no need to sue to recover the clear liability of the ski boat to repair the fishing boat. I think it is a crappy statement on the state of our society that litigation has begun to be almost an automatic reaction to any bad thing that happens to anyone, on any day.
Not to dump on anybody here, but we are surrounded by a continuing escalation people trying to affix blame and collect damages. The long term outlook for these habits could make the world a truly petty, and ugly, place to live in the future. |
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Posts: 1767
Location: Lake Country, Wisconsin | The fact I don't see you insulting the other driver makes you a better person then me. If I got hit like that by a tuber, I can only imagine how I would react. Irate is an understatement. Either this person would be compensating me real quick or you can bet a lawyer would be contacted real quick. Glad to hear you are ok
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Posts: 2691
Location: Pewaukee, Wisconsin | Ben, thats a bummer for sure. Even if your the perfect guide with all the proper safty equipment and insurance there is always the other drivers who have to be watched. I always watch boats around me while fishing. Your situation is one we always fear is going to happen around metro lakes. I am gald your ok and your friend is ok. That could have been way worse. As for some coments about compensation, you got to do what is best for yourself and your buisness. This is going to cost you money and time on the water. I would talk to a lawyer and see how to handle this situation.
Good tip on the air horn. I had to start up my boat and move one time on Pewaukee. It was a kid in his parents boat, he would have hit me and my clients for sure. I had a long talk with his parents after my clients were out of my boat. I knew the boat and made sure it was discussed with the kid and parents.
One thing I have extra is a secondary million dollar umbrella to cover anything over and above what my regular insurance will not cover in a bad situation like that. You can do your job but sometimes you can't help what others do.
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Location: Athens, Ohio | Times like this is why I usually always wear a life jacket while boating. Glad you are still living to tell the story, I hope damages are well compensated to you and the state watercraft folks lay down heavy on the driver. m |
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Posts: 1316
Location: Madison, WI | Wow! Unfortunate accident, glad everyone is still up and moving. Most defiant a near fatal situation, I'd talk with a lawyer if i were in your shoes. Not to clean the people out dry, but you need to be compensated for time lost on the water, injuries, and boat repairs.. |
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Posts: 561
Location: Monee, Illinois | Wow, did you catch any fish before that? |
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Posts: 1769
Location: Algonquin, ILL | Glad your OK, I would at least talk With a Lawyer not so much as to Sue the Individual but to make sure all the I's are dotted T's are crossed in case thier Insurance Company tries to pull some fast one on the repairs / replacement of your boat and equipment or they try to put the blame on you somehow.
You did not mention but was a Police report Filed ?
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Posts: 382
| Take her to the cleaners!! No excuses for that type of behavior on the water. Sometimes the only way people learn is when you hit them in the pocketbook. Glad to hear that you are both safe and alive. Get to a lawyer ASAP |
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| glad everyone's ok and you're safe, Ben.
great testimonial about your boat's ability to hold up under an extreme "test" of stability and flotation!
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Posts: 619
Location: Verona, WI | You definitely need to see a lawyer particularly given that that boat is your livelihood. The other person's insurance company/attorney is going to low ball you on your lost time, etc, etc.
Shane |
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Posts: 154
Location: Appleton, WI | I am glad to hear that you and your friend are safe. I hope the other people are safe also. I also hope they learned a valuable lesson. This could have been a much worse situation. |
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| I am glad to here you are ok.God bless you!!! |
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Posts: 1316
Location: Madison, WI | To be honest, I really wouldn't trust a boat that went through that type of impact. Last thing you need is a weak spot when you're on some big water or heavy waves. Sure everything looks fine, but i'd be shooting for a total lose.. |
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Posts: 1086
| Wow. Glad to hear everyone's safe. Boats, rods, reels and gear can be replaced...on her dime of course. But..human lives can't be replaced. Definitely make sure a police report is filed asap if one hasn't been already. Take LOTS of pictures and assess what's been lost. Get in contact with your insurance asap. Hopefully you got all of her information,name, address, etc, etc, the make, model and year of her boat as well as her boat registration number and maybe even her boat's HIN number?
Not so sure a full, "sue the pants off of her" is necessary...but...in today's day and age...as much as it very much indeed is a sue-happy world...you gotta CYA (cover your arse).
There are just simply way too many idiots in this world and 90% of them think they know how to drive both cars and boats. This woman...had no business watching behind her. Her one and ONLY responsibility was to look forward and drive that boat. That's why it's MANDATORY to have spotters in the boat at all times when pulling a tuber/skier. That's the spotters job to watch the skier/tuber. NOT the driver. Duh.
I'm amazed you're that calm too. I'd be livid. But...I'd do what is necessary to make sure the I's are dotted and the T's are crossed like someone has already stated. Again...CYA.
Hope it all works out.
It sure is a nice testimonial for Ranger and their ability to stand up to blunt force impact from another boat at a speed like that.
Edited by MACK 7/3/2007 8:35 AM
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Posts: 551
Location: Columbus, Georgia | I believe that that the driver of the other boat should lose her driver's license (auto) for a good while over the accident.
Ben; glad to hear that you and your friend turned out OK.
I feel more comfortable on the water when I assume that EVERY pleasurer boater and jet skier is a maniac, especially around holidays. I take nothing for granted when it comes to these pedestrian boaters.
Edited by cjrich 7/3/2007 9:03 AM
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Posts: 66
Location: Tomahawk, WI | Wow! That's something all of us fear when out on the water. I hope you and your friend are going to be alright. I also hope that you did file a police report. I'm with the other guys when saying that I wouldn't trust that boat anymore, consider it a full loss. You don't want it splitting in half while far away from civilization, or anywhere for that matter. She should pay for everything, and if she refuses, then that is when I would bring up the word "sue". What happened wasn't a small thing. Someone could have easily been killed from everyone in the boat's stupidity. |
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Posts: 1316
Location: Madison, WI | Oh and take PLENTY of pictures!! Then post some up if you can. |
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Posts: 227
Location: Southeast Wisconsin | Thanks for your kind words guys!!
I agree with the "sue happy" comment, but I agree with the SUE her A$$ off comment even more. Sorry firstsixfeet, but lets see how you feel when someone slams into the side of your boat that you use to put food on your table..Trust me, your gonna sue there butts off, which is exactly what Im going to do to this woman.
I called the cops from the water and also "rangled" up a few witnesses that saw it happen. Police reports filed, attorneys been called. I went to the ER yesterday morning after I woke up in pain and found I have 2 bruised knees and possible wiplash (REAL wiplash..LOL)
I am one of the safest guys on the water you will ever meet. I always watch my surroundings, carry more than enough insurance,blah blah blah and nothing could of avoided this situation. The only thing Im thankfull for is that my buddy and I were out different sides of the boat. had we both been casting towrads the point/shore neither of us would of seen the boat and it probably would of been WAY worse.
The woman who hit us is fully insured, and yes, I wanted to scream my head off at her and possibly even jump in there boat and start swinging, but it wouldnt of done anybody any good. What Im more pissed about than anything else is that I had a boater alsmot hit me again yesterday. when I drove back to my house later, which is tucked away in a wind blocked bay, I see the lake cop in his boat reading the paper.
I would post pics of the damage, but there rreally isnt much that would show up on camera. After the impact I looked over thye side expecting to see a hole ripped in my boat. The most damage is a 6x3 foot span that is filled with cracks. The boat may be totaled, but I doubt it. I fished all day yesterday and it wasnt taking on water or anything. Im going to pull it out today and run it over for an estimate. Hopefully its an easy fix.
Ill let you guys know the outcome..Thanks again!! |
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Posts: 227
Location: Southeast Wisconsin | BTW-The judicial system is set up to help people in cases like this. Its unfortunant that some people take advantage of the system to gain finacially through fake injurys and false claims. On the flip side, you have insurance companys low ballin people, which is usually what provokes litagation in the first place. Anytime you've been wronged you have the right to recover your losses and you should never feel bad about suing ....Bottom line |
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Posts: 699
Location: Hugo, MN | Bottom line is that this broad was completely and utterly negligent in this case. I'm not a fan of litigation and we have to much of it in our society today however, when someone exhibits Gross Negligence such as this they should be sued out of house home and especially boat!!!! I've had too many near misses myself due to waterskiers who think they own the #*^@ed lake and it probably my only fear on the water. |
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Posts: 1086
| Ben Kueng - 7/3/2007 9:44 AM
I would post pics of the damage, but there rreally isnt much that would show up on camera. After the impact I looked over thye side expecting to see a hole ripped in my boat. The most damage is a 6x3 foot span that is filled with cracks. The boat may be totaled, but I doubt it. I fished all day yesterday and it wasnt taking on water or anything. Im going to pull it out today and run it over for an estimate. Hopefully its an easy fix.
Ill let you guys know the outcome..Thanks again!!
Ben,
There may very well be more damage to that boat than what's visible to the naked, untrained eye.
It's glass boat, correct? Being a Ranger, I'm assuming so.
Here's a nugget of info that may help you take this to the next level:
A few years back...my brother-in-laws wave runner was stolen from his launch and someone took it for a joy ride...but...decided to bring it back, after they either hit a pier with it or another boat.
The damage didn't look like much to our own, untrained, naked eyes. But...it's fiberglass that you're dealing with there. My bro-in-laws wave runner had some serious cracks and even some glass material missing from the side of the waverunner...probably about 6 to 8" inches in length.
He took the wave runner in to a fiberglass repair shop, the best recommended in town.
Due to the cracks in the fiberglass.....water had seeped in and was sinking further into the glass material and was beginning to separate the material as it soaked in and warmed up and expanded.
You may not see much damage right now...but...you might start to see more damage as time goes on.
The repair shop "fixed" the glass on the wave runner the first time...and within 24 hours of waiting for it to cure.....he immediately started to see it bubble up again due to the fact that there was still trapped water inside the layers of the glass. It had to all be stripped down and redone a second time. The repair shop had to take more glass material away than what was initially damaged, just to get down past where the water had seeped in. He had to really take away any chances that there was any bad material left and had to strip it down further and strip about 20 inches of material away to ensure he got himself into "good" glass to then re-do his first initial repair.
If you have a good fiberglass shop around...or if a Ranger dealer is near you....go have them look at it. There may be more structural damage to that boat than you're aware of right now. Better to be safe than sorry and to make sure things are looked at accurately vs. going on assumptions that it's not that bad. Let a reputable fiberglass repair shop make that call. The surface damage that you're seeing may not even be the start of what's wrong internally or underneath. Get a few estimates if you can. Be very thorough.
Edited by MACK 7/3/2007 11:15 AM
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| you have insurance companys low ballin people, which is usually what provokes litagation in the first place. Anytime you've been wronged you have the right to recover your losses and you should never feel bad about suing...Bottom line
it's entirely possible, that her insurance company will simply agree to fully cover the cost of medical expenses and repairs to your boat. it sounds like your lost wages are minimal if you're out on the water without problem.
i've never had a problem getting proper payment from major insurance companies when i've suffered a legitmate loss that was obviously the other person's fault.
wait and see what they offer in terms of damages, time, etc. before hitting the "attack" button. IF they give you an insufficient offer, then is the time to consider litigation. for which pictures and documentation are very very helpful...
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Posts: 227
Location: Southeast Wisconsin | Thanks for the info mack! As soon as the rain clears out Im taking it up to the shop for an evaluation/estimate.
Hopefully her ins company covers everything without to much trouble. My boat is floating now and Im not having to cancel any trips but, that will all change drastically once the boat is in for repairs. Ive heard of fiberglass repairs taking 1-3 months to complete which would basically bankrupt me at this point. Not to mention theres very few people in the area who do this type of work. When it comes to my life, I think Ill call my attorney first and ask questions last..LOL |
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Posts: 1086
| I don't suppose there's a "rental" program for boats anywhere to keep you out on the water working while your boat's in for repair? I'd think that her insurance should cover all costs for rentals as well. You may not get a Ranger to rent...but if you could even find some simple Fish & Ski or something of that nature to keep you out doing what you do...you may have to compromise for a while. Just a thought. |
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Posts: 2384
Location: On the X that marks the mucky spot | One thing to consider since it's a Ranger. The reason you didn't have as much visible damage is because they fill those things up with foam. The problem with that is with an impact like you had, there is most surely areas of the hull where the foam has come apart from the fiberglass. This soft spot will affect your performance and long-term durability. I'd call Ranger and talk to one of their engineers if you get the chance and get their take on it. It could be MUCH worse then you think. |
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| You two are very lucky given what happened. I would demand a new rig replaced as was along with damages to cover injuries. Good luck, and I hope I don't run into her out there! |
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| I think it would be a mistake to contact your attorney first and ask questions last...here me out on this one and it could save you $$ in the long run.
It's not about being a litigious society and all that jazz. This is no different than a car accident really. You don't have serious injuries. You have clear damages to your boat. Liability is clearly on the other driver as you were stationary. The only questionable damages would be lost time if you have any. This is a relatively simple claim. This isn't health insurance. Property casualty insurers are much much less likely to "cheat" someone. There are attorneys who would have you think otherwise however...
If the lady is fully insured, you won't be causing her any financial difficulties whatsoever...so punishment isn't an option. Yes her premiums will go up...whether you just have a scratch or your boat is totaled...it doesn't matter really in this case as the damages are limited.
To go along with the damages being limited...more than likely the lady's insurance company will offer you a reasonable fair settlement figure to begin with. When it comes to recovering for standard property casualty claims, you will have be limited to an actual cash value of your losses. There will not be punitive damages unless there is gross negligence (basically something really criminal..ie being drunk and killing somebody). For the most part these are fixed. Your boat damages can easily be acquired. Your medical bills seem minimal if you guys didn't go to the doctor. You will be able to recover lost wages if you lose time on the water guiding. But only those that you can document (this is important).
The best bet is to see what the other insurance company is offering.
- boat repairs - make sure they are from a reputable dealer and all will be fine.
- total loss (if it is) - they will depreciate it no doubt...but have in mind all the add-ons and maintenance that you have performed. Also keep in mind the value a comparable model...not necessarily a brand new model. The other company only owes you for what your's is worth b/c that's the damages that were caused...not necessarily a new one (unless yours is #*^@ near brand new. Guiding adds to wear and tear regardless of how meticulous you are. You can negotiate...but the insurance company will be able to document what they offer...so you’re negotiation will be minimal. Chances are they'll be fairly close. THIS IS KEY THOUGH>>>If you have progressive (or another that offers this) and they automatically give you a new boat the same as they one you have, you might consider getting boat damages handled through your own insurance...then your insurance company can dicker with the other lady's insurance to get the money back (save's you the hassle and you get a new boat if have that coverage...sweet deal if you ask me).
- lost wages - you only can recover for what you actually lose due to injury and or in this case loss of use of your boat. If a suitable replacement boat can be supplied, you are only entitled to the cost of the replacement boat per day (you will have to earn the rest by guiding). If no replacement can be acquired, your loss of use of the boat will not be the cost to rent one, it will be the wages you can document (typically this means receipts and what you report to the IRS).
- injury - you can recover the cost of your medical bills as well as any sort of pain and suffering. Your medical bills seem limited. However, even if you have none you are still entitled to a minimal amount of P+S. It's just limited because you can't document your injuries. Best to understand that you aren't going to get 10,000 bucks for your injury if you're fine after a couple of days.
Consider the above and decide if you would want to hire an attorney. They are not miracle workers. Getting an attorney doesn't mean you're "suing". However, it does mean that you are forfeiting 1/3 of your settlement. This can be big time if you're talking about boat damages too. So an attorney might be better at negotiations and get you an extra 2 grand on top of the 10 the adjuster offered you yourself to begin with. That just means you get 8 and the attorney gets 4. You gotta think about this stuff before it costs you.
Most of the time though, people will get an attorney first, never knowing that the insurance company is settling the claim with the attorney for the SAME amount as they would have with the person who suffered the loss. Attorneys don’t change amounts being offered.
I was an adjuster for 5 years...I saw what happened in the above paragraph happen on a weekly basis. Most people get screwed and they don't even know it. See what they offer first. If you aren't happy, take that to an attorney and tell them that is the least you will walk away with, period, no matter what the attorney negotiates for. Have that in your contract with the attorney. Then see what happens.
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Posts: 227
Location: Southeast Wisconsin | Thanks for the tips halfpint. Once I get the police report and estimate done on thursday Im going to contact her insurance company and try to work everything out. I will also contact Ranger and speak with one of there engineers.
Thanks again to everyone for all the help and ideas!! |
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Posts: 110
Location: NEW LENOX IL | Ben, glad there were no "serious" injuries .
Thank you for the air horn tip. Now I will have one at the helm and one on the front deck of my boat.
GREAT TIP !
Hope you have a quick recovery
Dave |
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| A lawyer will take as his fee, 33.3% of any insurance settlement he obtains for you. Try to work with the insured's carrier first. If they start to back off, then hire an attorney. Whatever you do, DO NOT sign a release for AT LEAST ONE YEAR and DO NOT give a statement without representation. |
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| Here's my take on this.
I have a 4 year old son, a 15 month old daughter, and a baby on the way. I could not imagine my wife having to explain to my children that daddy is no longer with us because he was hit by a woman driving a boat, not paying attention, pulling her kids on an tube.
My wife is an attorney, and was a defense litigator for some time, representing insurance companies and railroads. She's seen it all and has shared a lot with me. There are a lot of people out there trying to cheat the system and "take dives", but in this case, even though it was an accident, hit this woman where it hurts because of her negligence and stupidity. Hit her future pocket book and go after her insurance company. If she wants to drive a car, a boat, etc., make it miserable for her to pay for the insurance. She jeapordized your life, your fishing partners' lives, and everyone in her boat's lives. Let her know that this mistake will cost her as long as she lives.
Premiums don't go up for those who are safe driver/boaters.
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| Stay on your insurance company and they will assign an attorney to this claim. |
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Posts: 82
| Glad you are ok!
Accidents happen but when you are talking jet skis,ski boats, and even wind surfers this is to often an occurence. Perhaps I am senstive because today I go out and between me and the shore that is 75 yards away I had all the "recreational enthusiasts" making their turns between me and the shore, unfortunately most of them were paying more attention to the skier behind the boat or, if jet ski, looking for the big wake and not minding my bait landing in front of them.
I respect the opportunities the water provides for all, unfortunately the lack of respect, or common sense by others compromises the safety of others. Thus I believe more time and effort ought to be spent on education and enforcement of the lakes where there is a high probability of this occuring. We spend thousand of dollars on stocking and fishery management, I think it is time we spend a bit more on "boater" management! |
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Posts: 956
Location: Home of the 2016 World Series Champion Cubs | Ben, Glad you and your partner are okay. Now the important stuff...I would like to hire you this month for an entire week. No make it two. What, you have no boat.......... #*^@ now youve lost another two weeks income.  If you need a client affidavit we're all here for ya.
Karl |
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Posts: 227
Location: Southeast Wisconsin | Actually, didnt you have me booked for all of aug Karl??..LOL
Got the estimate today and its looking like $8800 is the grand total for the body repairs. That doesnt include my depthfinder, rods,reels and my buddies cell and sunglasses..The sad part is that I will be without my boat for 2-3 weeks that Im booked solid. Im probably the only guy who you'll hear complaining about a 3 week paid vacation...LOL
Thanks again for all the info and kind words!!
Edited by Ben Kueng 7/5/2007 5:29 PM
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Posts: 203
| Hey Mike JONES,
LEt me know if you dont have a rental or backup boat... My boat is always available for you to use...Hehe.. But you get hit in my boat, Your pretty much not making it out alive..
Let me know when you want to go fishin.
bret |
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Lucky to be alive!!