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Posts: 335
Location: Pulaski, WI | Being an old smallmouth fisherman, I love chartreuse. I'm looking to widen my horizons, how do you determine when to throw batis with chartreuse versus orange?
Thanks,
John |
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Posts: 617
Location: Clintonville, WI | No profound basis for my reply.....but I choose to throw orange because of personal history. In the last 10 years, I have only caught ONE FISH on chartreuse - a 33" dink on a chartreuse bandit Manta in '03. Either all orange baits or baits with orange somewhere on them have produced consistently when I choose to fish dark water, or water that has produced fish when using that color.
I personally like chartreuse (I'm not the one striking, though) and always think it has got to produce, but it never happens. I'm sure there are waters where chartreuse is a productive color. I just haven't found/fished any of them yet. |
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| I like both, but Orange does much better!  |
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Posts: 20214
Location: oswego, il | I am just the oppossite of you guys. I like chartruse baits on brown stained water during the day and it is great on algae lakes and clear water during low light. I hardly ever throw a predominantly orange bait. I just seem to do better with chartruse. |
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Posts: 152
| I use orange in muddy water and chartreuse in green water. I don't really use chartreuse, but firetiger. There are a lot of things that influence what color I start with. Green penetrates deeper than red/orange, so depth of the lure is a factor. Matching water color is the main thing I do when selecting a color to start with. Later |
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Posts: 1046
| The pattern I have seen is colder water orange types and as the water warms switching to Chart. produces better for me. Water color has no effect on my color selection. |
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| What MuskyBoy said. Orange for me, chartreuse a close 2nd. |
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Posts: 1769
Location: Algonquin, ILL | I prefer Chartreuse over Orange it just seems to stand out better
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Posts: 1310
Location: Washington, PA | I prefer orange. |
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Posts: 2515
Location: Waukesha & Land O Lakes, WI | Throw FireTiger and you get the best of both worlds!! |
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| I have the answer!!!
one of the standard Jerko and Squirko Patterns is a Char orange Tiger
Char belly with orange sides and black tiger bars or flop dots. this color combo is great. I also have good luck on tripple d's in this pattern.. best of bolth worlds.
Keith Eldrup |
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Posts: 572
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chartreuse in Missouri and orange in Ontario.
Since black bucktails with orange blades seem to be popular in Ontario, I assume there must be a reason. Orange does seem to work better there for me. However, chartreuse should not be overlooked, as that may be just what the muskie is looking for.
I think the orange is for darker or stained lakes, and the chartreuse for all lakes, including clear.
As to suicks, I know a few who think a chartreuse suick (with black or red dots) is one of the better lures no matter what the water color is (except extreme muddy conditions). Since you favor chartreuse, I recommend you fishing with one.
As to crankbaits and jerkbaits, the chartreuse wins the confidence vote. Actually, firetiger and
perch wins there.
If you are fairly new to muskie fishing, I'd recommend you research on how to figure eight,
land or net a fish, and proper handling (for your safety, as well as, the fish).
Good fishing,
Muskie Bob |
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| There were a couple articles in In-Fisherman, maybe something on the web too, about color penetration in various tints to the water.
My old standby has been orange in brown water, chart in clear and green (more because I can see it well than anything else). I also use orange more in the fall, and chart in the summer, for whatever reason. They are probably interchangeable as high-visibility lures until you figure out a pattern or a specific lake where on is better. Overall, I use blades chartreuse a lot more than orange, but seldom throw a chartreuse jerkbait--go figure... |
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| Orange here. I probably have more orange lures thatn green. I'm assuming too that when we say orange it is the blaze or fluorescent orange. Are a muskies eyes similiar to a walleyes? I doubt it. Their eyes don't shine at night. Walleye only have two color cones, orange and green. As far as a muskies cones I haven't seen any stidies on them. |
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Posts: 3518
Location: north central wisconsin | Orange used to be my stand by favorite/confidence color. I have been doing better consistantly with chartreause/green combo type lures the past couple seasons. I used to have a tough tme tossing all chartreause baits, especially spinnerbaits. Big fish just kept eating that color last year. I do like orange and bright red blades best on dark dirty water, and do best on bright orange lures in fast current situations. |
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| I've done well with orange on sunny days and chartruse on cloudy days.
Ty |
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| Both work great, especially if you put them in front of a big hungry skister! |
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Posts: 32885
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | Here's a corker:
Chartreuse is basically an optically brightened green. Green is a compound color mixing yellow and blue. If the base color is blue with yellow added it will be a darker grey in low light that if it's the other way around.
Orange is red and yellow. If he base is red, the lure will be near black in low light. if the base is yellow, it will be a much lighter grey.
How to check out the low light color? Hang the lures on a line with the sun on them at sunset, and watch as the light dimishes to see whether they are light/dark in low light. Keep in mind the water filters out alot of the color too, so many times the actual color of the lure under water isn't at all what you are seeing in the bright light of the surface world.
Just an observation! |
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Posts: 333
Location: menasha wi 54952 | Steve,
Great answer!!!!
Check it out. Now you will know why one black bucktail with a orange blade is better than another!!!
MR |
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Posts: 814
| I like both they both produce for me. I have better luck with orange in stained water and chartreuse in clearer water, though black and orange bucktail is one of my top producing lures and colors. |
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Posts: 148
Location: DES MOINES, IOWA | In the stained water of Sabaskong, Orange has always been a big color,but we have taken a lot of Muskies on Chartreuse,also.My top plastic bait is Orange by far.I seem to be able to see Orange in the water farther than Chartreuse.The top spinner bait for Northerns by far is Orange/Black.Fishing weed beds for Muskies,whoever is throwing that color combo is going to be hauling out Pike on a regular basis. |
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| A musky guide in N. WI told me last summer that orange is the last color muskies see before total darkness. We were fishing late evening to darkness. Makes sense since orange is the color you have to wear for deer hunting. Assuming we see color the same as muskies. |
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| Keith: What are "flop dots"? Thanks. |
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Posts: 132
Location: Kawarthas, Ontario | Simple answer: the colour spectrum - ROYGBIV
Orange is lower in the colour spectrum, and hence is slightly more visible than chartreuse. Orange tends to produce a slightly better contrast than chartreuse, although I've had tremendous success with both colours.
Regards,
Edited by strike_zone 2/23/2005 12:42 PM
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Posts: 156
Location: Oconomowoc, WI | Something to think about...Everyone seems to be making the assumption that the lure a muskie sees better is the better choice. I think there are times when a lure that is less visable will outproduce one that is highly visible. Grey/white bucktails just under the surface have produced very well for me on cloudy/overcast days. The fish feels vibration, and I'm sure also sees the bait, but when it can't make out the lure perfectly, it probably can be fooled easier..... |
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Posts: 714
Location: Rhinelander, WI | FYI
From a safety clothing company.
Is hi-vis fluorescent yellow really more visible than fluorescent orange?
Absolutely. In a large-scale survey by the Minnesota Department of Transportation at the 1990 Minnesota State Fair, four mannequins were displayed, each with a different fluorescent-colored jumpsuit. Fair attendees were then asked which mannequin appeared the most visible.
The results:
Fluorescent yellow: 5796
Fluorescent green: 2706
Fluorescent orange: 2231
Fluorescent pink: 2017
Amazingly, of the 119 color-impaired voters, 115 chose fluorescent yellow as most visible.
Don't know if that helps but if it's visibility you want fluorecent yellow is the way to go.
I try to use fluorecent yellow & green in low light and Orange in bright light. I think it has paid off for me.
Nail A Pig!
Mike
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Posts: 1937
Location: Black Creek, WI | I do what MRoberts does.
jlong |
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| I heard southern strain muskie here in Ky are fed goldfish once they grow in size at the fisheries. Don't know if its true or or not but orange is my top color here. Anyone know if this rumor is true? |
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Posts: 32885
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | JimL,
Actually, by near dark the Muskie probably is not able to see any color at all. What will stand out is contrast, so I make sure the background and the lure are at odds as much as I possibly can.
I support the idea that a Fl Yellow will be more visible, as it is a primary and a shorter wavelength. Red which is longer WL and is a component of orange, is the first to go in low light. |
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Posts: 1438
| You beat me to it Steve. I was going to ask if it was Oragne red base or Orange yellow base.
Scott |
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| Steve,
I have been researching this but can’t find a study on what wavelengths of light remain visible at low light levels. The ERC website has some good links to muskie biology. According to most of the studies, muskies don't have cones (color receptors) for the shorter wavelengths of light (blue and purple). It also says a muskie has a yellow filter in its cornea which act kind of like the yellow sunglass lens's and increases contrast.
I said a guide told me orange is the last color visible before complete dark, he writes for Esox angler. Here is my reasoning on why he said this. Light colors are different than pigment colors. To get yellow light you have to combine red and green. The lake we were fishing was clear with a slight algae bloom. The algae would absorb some of the green light thus making colors closer to red being more visible Thus orange.
Here is a site that has some good info on muskie color vison I found through the ERC website.
http://www.trentu.ca/muskie/biology/biol07.html
So, muskies can see colors, but not into the blue end of the spectrum (blues and purples probably appear as grey to them). The best colors for muskies are in the red-orange-yellow-green portions of the spectrum. Interestingly, muskies also have a distinctly yellow lens and cornea that helps filter out the shorter wavelengths (Bridges, 1969)
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Posts: 32885
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | We are discussing lure colors here, so what is reflected back to the eye is what is important to the discussion. All other light is absorbed by the bait and the color reflected represents the bait color. If that color has been filtered out by the water's natural prism action, then a representative shade of grey to black will be available to the eye.
Another factor is that the cone cells in the fish's eyes extend on a 'sun clock' basis, and retract the same way. It's probable that the muskie is operating nearly totally on rod vision by dusk, anyway, so color is irrrelevant at that point. Contrast is king, no matter what the discussion, in my humble opinion.
Also, most of the light is reflected back from the surface late evening due to the sun angle. Light on the surface isn't what's available under the surface, even just a few inches down.
Add to that the fact the muskie is looking up most of the time, and you have the total mental image necessary to make a color/contrast judgement.
Some examples of what I mean by all of this:
1) The Color of Objects
Here we consider the color of an object illuminated by white light. Color is produced by the absorption of selected wavelengths of light by an object. Objects can be thought of as absorbing all colors except the colors of their appearance which are reflected. A blue object illuminated by white light absorbs most of the wavelengths except those corresponding to blue light. These blue wavelengths are reflected by the object.
2) The Eye and Color Sensation
Our perception of color arises from the composition of light - the energy spectrum of photons - which enter the eye. The retina on the inner surface of the back of the eye contains photosensitive cells. These cells contain pigments which absorb visible light. Of the two classes of photosensitive cells, rods and cones, it is the cones that allow us to distinguish between different colors. The rods are effective in dim light and sense differences in light intensity - the flux of incident photons - not photon energy. So in dim light we perceive colored objects as shades of grey, not shades of color.
3) The light spectrum is well known. "ROY G. BIV" is an acronym used to remember the colors from one end to the other. From left to right the letters stand for: Red, Orange, Yellow, Green, Blue, Indigo, and Violet. A mixture of all the colors makes white light. That is, if one were to take 7 flashlights, each of which was giving off one of the listed colors, and shine all the different colors on a white wall, the spot of light would be white! A white light, therefore, gives off all the colors.
4) Absolutely perfectly clear water acts as a selective filter. If one were to suspend a white spot light above the surface with perfect vertical light penetration throughout the water column of a tank of water that was 100' deep, the colors from the white light would be filtered out selectively one-by-one. It is gradual. For example, most of the red is gone from the light after 10 feet. Some of the orange is gone. Less of the yellow is lost, etc. At 25' most of the orange is gone. At 35' most of the yellow is gone. This continues through the spectrum until all that is left is violet light and that fades out after hundreds of feet.
5) Fish color vision is probably very different from ours. Contrast betweeen the color of the foreground and the background is important for their sight.
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Posts: 335
Location: Pulaski, WI | So how would we apply some of this contrast discussion to my question about bars vs. spots? |
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Posts: 1536
Location: God's Country......USA..... Western Wisconsin | Orange seems to work the very best for me as in Black hair with orange blades etc. However in that stained or dirty water I like the Firetiger to get both colors working for me. Try a firetiger colored bait and bright flashy gold plated blades in the sunlight. Firetiger blades in any lowlight condition. Gotta love that Firetiger Suick with the flashy tail as well. Seems to work for me. |
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Chartreuse vs. Orange