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Posts: 561
Location: Monee, Illinois | I know this site is about musky and all....I have been fishing for over 30 years and I am a converted bass fisherman. I fell in love or caught the fever as we say, with musky. About a week ago I posted a reply and added a lake that I fished for the first time. Got a phone call and was asked to take the name of the lake down. I was asked very nice and it was just a suggestion. They didnt want the lake to turn into a overfished lake (if thats the right word). I fish Webster and Shabbona, very HIGH pressure lakes that hold musky. Do we have too many musky fisherman, do we need more, more lakes and so on. What do you all think. Just a thought but do we need to introduce more if there isnt enough water to fish. Or do we want to have more and more fisherman.
My take is this, I am a PGA Golf Professional, I wan't as many golfers as there are people, because that is my life. Now if I was a musky guide I would want the same for musky fishers. Before I became a Golf Professional I played golf all the time since my father is also a Golf Professional. Back then I didn't want anyone to play the game, the more people that played the more crowds were on the course, the longer the rounds took. What do you guys and gals think? I am just thinking thats all.......
If you would vote and put a comment on what you think needs to be done to sway your vote to the other side....
Edited by pgaschulz 11/29/2004 9:36 PM
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Posts: 20281
Location: oswego, il | The more fisherman there are the more money there will be put into it, the more lure companies and eventally more lakes. Our sport is growing, who is anybody to say who can and who can't fish for muskies. Yes it's nice to not fish a crowded lake but nothing stays a secret forever unfortunatley. Bottom line, we do need more lakes, southern wi needs alot more, minnesota needs hundreds more and most states need more lakes. States like colorado need to recognize the musky as a gamefish and manage them that way and maine just needs to recognize musky as something other than vermon. |
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Posts: 32958
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | It's not a matter of 'need'. The sport is growing, and all the benefits and negatives of growth will be part and parcel. The good WILL outweigh the bad, that's a sure thing. I welcome each and every new Muskie stick to the sport. Welcome to my Nightmare! |
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Posts: 466
Location: Pittsburgh, PA | i would like to see the sport grow around here (out east). as long as people dont start fishing my spots lol jk |
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| Unless we get alot more lakes that have muskies we don't need more people in the sport. I am sure alot of guys feel this way but aren't going to say it due to being immediately hit with the "negative" tag. I have seen more new boats on the small waters I fish than ever before and if that trend continues without any new waters it is going to be an absolute circus! |
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Posts: 1086
| This is a good question...and I see both sides and their pros and cons to each.
I'm just curious as to why just now, as of late, this sport of muskie fishing is taking off? Why hasn't it been as popular as bass or walleye fishing through the ages? Is that due to back through the ages that there hasn't been as many lakes to have access to these fish that we have today?
For 22 years I've been fishing for pike and muskie and I don't understand why the buzz hasn't been going crazy even long before I came along here on planet Earth...pike and muskie have been around a loooooong time.
For years I've wanted to move west to Colorado...but have always taken into account that the fish that I fish for aren't as prevelant out there, if they're even located out there at all. I think it'd be great to see muskie and pike introduced out there for sport. Pike may already be there...I don't remember. Now...that's not the sole reason why I haven't moved out there...but....it's something I've thought about.  |
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| Interesting question. I believe that we need more muskie fisheries spread across the us. Easy statement to make, difficult one to fulfill. There really aren't any "secret" lakes anymore esp. with the strength of the internet. It's easy to publish information and it's easier to locate information.
Through the 90's we witnessed a boom for muskie fishing and I firmly believe that the majority of why can be attributed to the internet. From the very helpful and very effective listServs to the ascerbic early days of message boards to what we have now which is a handful of very well run message boards, each with it's own personality.
I'm wandering, I know. What I'm trying to build up to is that we're in an age of "maturation" for the sport. Kind of like a teenager. We have gone through some growth and now were settling in again. I for one believe that the muskie angler populations are at an acceptable level and we need to continue to bring new members into the sport, especially younger conservation minded people to replace the ones that roll off for what ever reasons. I don't think we need an aggressive recruitment program though until we lay a foundation of new muskie waters over a broader geographic range.
One thing I find interesting is that Muskie fishing is pretty much an anglo sport. Look through EA or MHM over the past year and count the number eastern indians, blacks, hispanics, asians you see pictured. I doubt you'll get off one hand. Why is that? I know it's not a conspiracy or intentional effort. Is it a cultural thing? The discussion about the hmong's last week got me thinking about this.
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Posts: 2515
Location: Waukesha & Land O Lakes, WI | I think what's more important is to ask is this...Do we need more EDUCATED musky fishermen and women? What's the sense of a growing sport if people are going to ignore things like CPR and boating etiquette? |
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Posts: 87
| The way the sport has been growing, i think it will slow down. I already know people who have fished for a year or two and now they sold all their equipment. The only way we will get more lakes is if we let the dnr know we want them. They will have to know the numbers of fisherman are out there. |
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Posts: 7123
Location: Northwest Chicago Burbs | Before you answer this question, you really should ask yourself THESE QUESTIONS:
-do we want more muskie lakes?
-do we want more muskie clubs?
-do we want more and better muskie magazines?
-do we want more and better muskie internet sites (I'm personally against that one, I think one is enough)
-do we want better rods/reels?
-do we want more muskie tackle companies bringing out more new baits every year?
I doubt any of you would say NO to the above. Now think about it; if the muskie fishing population stops growing, or starts declining, what are the chances that the growth that we have already seen in the above statements will continute to grow.
Basically we all know it comes down to this: individually we all want more info on muskie fishing, muskie lakes, muskie science. And we all know we all want more and better gear to use to catch them. AND we know we all want more and better muskie lakes to fish. BUT NONE OF US WANT TO EVER FEEL LIKE SOMEONE IS ON OUR LAKE, OUR WEEDBED, OUR SPOT ON THE SPOT. We want all the benefits of a growing muskie population, we just dont ever want to feel like our lakes are "pressured" anymore than they are now, or they were.
Truth is the "golden days" of muskie fishing are right now, and if new muskie fisherman join the ranks because they see a show on tv that has muskies being caught, or they stumble onto a muskie website, or (gasp!) one of us takes a newbie out and introduces them to muskies....well then the "golden days" are going to continue.
What we NEED is more education on CPR, more education on true muskie biology (ie. against the "those muskies eat all our walleyes"), and more money for fish stocking. If we can find ways to increase that, while the sport continues to grow, the great muskie fishing we see now will just continue to get better and better. |
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Posts: 2515
Location: Waukesha & Land O Lakes, WI | Dont forget this question SlamR....With more Musky lakes and anglers, do guys/gals want to see more Tournaments? because that's what's going to happen, the sport will be more popular and more folks are going to want to make a competition out of it. |
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Posts: 7123
Location: Northwest Chicago Burbs | the sport will be more popular and more folks are going to want to make a competition out of it.
If that is what people want to do, that is what they should do. Doesnt that make sense? If it isnt directly harmful to the resource (anymore than catching them out of competition) who are we to tell them they cant use a COMMON resource for this type of useage? |
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Posts: 2515
Location: Waukesha & Land O Lakes, WI | I'm not against them man, I fish and love em but there's always going to be the Anti Tourny folks and the Tourny folks. Increasing the amount of Tournaments would bring controversy. Then comes the culling debate. |
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Posts: 341
| Why would anyone want more pressure on their lakes?? It's already the slowest sport know to man. I say keep it under ground which will hopefully always be the case due to catch percentages and persistence one must poses to have success in this sport.
I can't believe I haven't sunk my Tuffy and equipment in the middle of lake like I did my golf clubs.
Kill a guide to help stop the disease!! |
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Posts: 2089
| Very well said my friend.Personally, I want to see the "industry"grow, but with growth comes increased responsibility to educate.I have a financial interest .Not the only reason.I love introducing new people to the sport.If I'm with someone who wants to know more and learn more, then that's Nirvana.Muskie fishing is an extreme sport and the muskie is a fish.A resource, and thankfully a RENEWABLE resource through catch and release and hands on management."And that's all I've got to say 'bout that".I LOVE Minnesota! |
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Posts: 1335
Location: Chicago, Beverly | -do we want more muskie lakes? Yes
-do we want more muskie clubs? Not sure, I know of a couple that are just barely getting by now.
-do we want more and better muskie magazines? More? No, Better? Yes
-do we want more and better muskie internet sites (I'm personally against that one, I think one is enough)? Better? Sure, more I am not too sure on that, there are a decent amount out there now.
-do we want better rods/reels? Reels definitely.
-do we want more muskie tackle companies bringing out more new baits every year? Only if I win the lotto, otherwise I have too many already.
Definitely don't want any more pressure on already heavily pressured waters.
Tourney's? Nope, don't want these tourney trails coming to musky fishing.. I've seen the damage done by the bass guys to what were once decent Bass lakes.. Now, a once a year tourney on some big ole lake that can support a decent size tourney, or the little muskie inc type outings/tourney's.... sure those are ok..
Edited by kevin 11/30/2004 4:56 PM
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Posts: 1887
Location: syracuse indiana | i am kinda up in the air on this one. yes we do need more people to make this maddness grow. as a future guide(soon i hope) thats good for buisness. and great for our sport. i do know people who think otherwise. and on our small lakes here they do get pressure. but i feel just becouse a bunch of other boats and lures have hit my favorite spots. does not meen that that spot is bad couse it already has been worked. not all lures are thrown the same way and u go in that spot and do what u came there to do. i have fished behind people and have cought fish manytimes so it doesnt matter to me... thanx ....bill |
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Posts: 600
Location: West Bend, WI | I'm gona take heat for this,I would like it to stay the same if not a decline.Rods,Reels,Baits,Ect... I don't need better, I'm happy with whats out there now.I feel that Lake-Lake.com has been the worst thing for fishing that I have seen in my short time.I have seen many local lakes and rivers ruined by this site.I used to go down to the local river and catch 5-6 smallies a trip,and 1 would be 18" maybe a little bigger.I fished this river most of my life,so I have been on it to see the changes.Well anyways I used to check in on Lake-Link.com from time to time and one day someone started a thread (milwaukee river/west bend) About a month or so later there where people everywhere.I would see alot of people ,with fish being taken home,plus alot of undersized fish.I would call the local warden,and he would never show up to bust these people.I would really,really like to see someone go down there know and catch a decent fish today.Well anyways back to musky's,NO I do not own these waters or have the right to fish them by myself,But to me it's way out of hand.The musky lake I fish will have 15-20 musky rigs on it at a crack! plus skiers ect...The lake is only 209 acres and 2/3rds fishable.IMHO it's way out of hand.Fishing for me has always been a time to relax and have fun,not geting cut off by other fisherman and skiers.I know I sound like a cry baby but I just get so mad!! sometimes I don't even want to fish anymore. Thx for listening to my crying I had to tell sombody.  |
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Posts: 2112
Location: The Sportsman, home, or out on the water | Ummm.................YES!
The more interest in our sport, the more the industy will evolve, Like Salmr mentioned. If your fathers or uncles or whatever did not take you fishing you would probably think that it was stupid. I have afflicted my son and my wife and my best friend with this sickness we call musky, and I would not have it any other way! Do you not take your kids and/ or spouses/ and or friends musky fishing for the first time? You know you want it to grow. If you are afraid of fishing used water, you do not have PMA! If the elders did not teach us to fish to musky fish, you wouldn't know how. |
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Posts: 600
Location: West Bend, WI | nightmare you are right,I do take friends and family out,The thing I'm most proud of is puting peeps on there first fish.I'm just very concerned about some local waters not just musky waters.How about the fact that they cut down all the brush and habitat along the river to put in a walkway,or the largest apartment complex to ever be built in the town right on the river.I really am 2 sided on this just live in a bad area. |
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Posts: 600
Location: West Bend, WI | Also, nobody got me into fishing,I grew up with my mother and found it on my own.My elders would be the great people of this site,they taught me every thing I know.I try to give back to the site as much as possible. I take people out to show them what I love the most!! not see them in my (our) spot next time I head out.Ha Ha |
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Posts: 2112
Location: The Sportsman, home, or out on the water | I actually had no one to hold my hand into Musky fishing, and I cosider the elders of this sport to be the seminar speakers, journalists, etc.. I am happy that you were able to find out the enjoyment of fishing without anyone introducing you to it! That is pretty much the way I got into hunting! |
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| Great question PGA, I witnessed musky fishing explode here in Indiana over the last 5-6 yrs., especially the last 2. I never used to see musky boats out this late in the season at least not very many. I have seen webster's ramp packed on several weekdays this november. I feel that I'm lucky to live close to 6 musky lakes and get to take a trip up north at least once a year, but the pressure around here is becoming unbelievable. These lakes will still produce fish, but the experience for me was getting away from people and fishing for big fish, it is getting tougher to do that. I think the only way to sustain decent musky fishing in this area is to add new lakes to the stocking programs. I hope this happens, but I don't think it will anytime soon. Indiana is what it is, pontoons and jetskis all summer long. Most people in this state simply don't respect the resources like they should and that is not just pertaining to the muskies but also to water quality and habitat destruction for all fishes which is a continual thing around here. Not sure whether we need more or less musky fisherman but we do need smarter property owners, smarter recreational boaters and smarter fisherman in terms of the environment. Otherwise I fear for what will happen to our musky fisheries around here.
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Posts: 1086
| We definitely need smarter recreational boaters as well. TWICE this season, while on Webster, I had some johnny jack@$$ buzz my boat within 20 yards at full speed as I was trolling, they would look over at me, wave and smile and see that I was trolling, rod in hand and line out the back for them to cut RIGHT behind me just off the back of my boat, theirs still full throttle, and cut my line!!!
A third time this past season I was out with my mother-in-law in the boat and a few of my nephews bluegill fishing. We were anchored on a drop off about 20 yards off of a shallow shelf that holds lillly pads. We had bobbers out on all sides of the boat. And here comes another johnny jack@$$, full throttle with his Ski Nautigue pulling a wake boarder that goes BETWEEN our boat and the those lilly pads only 20 yards away from us cutting one line!!!
The audacity I tell ya!
Webster is a tough, tough lake to endure during the summer months when the lakers are out. It's tough to share the small lake between the other fishermen and all the sport boating going on.
I understand that there's no unpopulated lakes in the state of Indiana that hold muskie, but I think those types of waters are where you could go for relaxation and lower pressure. As long as the lakes are populated with housing and boating, the sport will continue to grow like wild fire. Word of mouth is the biggest advertising. And now the internet is spreading the growth of muskie fishing even faster and hotter. |
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Posts: 1996
Location: Pelican Lake/Three Lakes Chain | There is not a doubt in my mind that we need/and can handle more musky fishers out there. I fish Northern Wisconsin waters daily, and really don't know where all the pressure is that everyone is refering to. Most weekdays I share the lake with one or two other rigs, or in the case of Pelican with maybe 10 or so. Of course weekend pressure gets a bit higher, but not anywhere near unbearable.
Last year on the opener I had about 1000 acres of water to myself, and this is not some secret lake X, it is a very well known pond. We boated three fish by 11:00 in the morning and never saw another musky fisher. We then went to the Three Lakes Chain. Now thats not even close to a secret lake X. Never had to share a spot with another boat, as a matter of fact, we very rarely had to share a lake. That is not high fishing pressure, and this is one of the musky hotspots of North America.
If you don't think we need more musky fishers just look at what happens to every musky proposal put in front of the general fishing public. It gets clobbered. If we had more folks on our side, the votes might start to swing a bit. The bigger voice we have the more our concerns will be heard, by not only the DNR, but also fishing manufacturers.
I realize there are areas that are highly populated with musky people that are severly lacking in musky water. That is unfortunate, but the only way you will get new waters is to be heard in great numbers.
I am a bit biased in my views, because the more people that are involved in the sport, the more that may request my services. On the flip side however, I am also very protective of my spots and hate sharing them with other boats. In my opinion, at least in Northern Wisconsin, there is a whole lot of room for growth yet.
Edited by nwild 12/1/2004 9:11 AM
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Posts: 2515
Location: Waukesha & Land O Lakes, WI | I used to think that we needed less people doing this because all that pressure was'nt good for the smaller lake systems......I was wrong, I'm seeing more and more guys musky fishing and I'm boating more and more fish myself every season.
Norm's 100% right, if you're worried about pressure, try picking your trips or vacation days so they're during the week. I'm lucky enough to be on one of the most notoriously easy fishing Musky lakes in NE Wisconsin. On any given Saturday during the season the launch is packed to the gills, come Sunday night and Monday...not a soul.
ToddM, MuskyHntr and I'm sure a alot of other Flatlanders can attest that I was downright nasty to them in an effort to make them think twice about coming here. Dumb. What I have done since then? Concentrated on my fishing instead of others and picked the right times to fish. If any of you guys who think they can't catch a fish on pressured water would fish 1 big tourny, you'd think otherwise. Put 20 rigs on the east end of Pewaukee lake in early spring and watch every body catch fish...it's amazing how many muskys are actually there. You just have to find the right approach to catch them. |
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Posts: 146
Location: Wayzata, MN | Water seaks it's own level [pardon the 'pun']... so... I don't think it matters if we want more or less fisherpeople...
I agree with whoever said education. That's a major key. I have had conversations with various people regarding the need for a license [similar to an drivers license] to run any watercraft... it would be manditory for all, not just kids. Maybe renewable [to cover rule changes and additions] No license? Can't run any watercraft.
At least there would not be any excuse for 'not knowing better' I think that would take quite a bit of our issues with other boaters [and jetsjiers] out of play.
It could also be a revenue stream for the DNR, to better our resources [everything costs money, right].
Then, we would have the opportunity to lobby and add our concerns into the testing... or add 'rules' that would be covered and taught ie: see a caster, stay "X" amount of feet from them, etc... just adding to the education of watercraft operators. The testing would, and should, be a live document. Ignorance isn't always bliss...
I don't think we can slow it down. We need to find new ways to educate all water of the users. And a way to fund it.
It cover a lot of things... I saw one idiot acid washing his hull at the landing... with the stuff washing down the landing into the water. Education, education, education....
Thanks for listening, I gotta step off the soapbox, get'n dizzy.... ;} |
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Posts: 146
Location: Wayzata, MN | Wow... me grammer bad............. |
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Posts: 1086
| Good ideas and great points Thrasher.
Man...the dude acid washing the boat there at the landing...nice. |
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Posts: 2112
Location: The Sportsman, home, or out on the water | More Musky fisherman, LESS JET SKIS! |
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Posts: 561
Location: Monee, Illinois | I like the responses, I feel that I need a private musky lake that no one fishes. Until I can afford that, I feel we need more fisherpeople. Just like in golf, once they saw the amount of golfers that came on in the 1990's you started seeing golf course popping up all around. In order for more musky lakes to be brought on line you will need more musky fisherpeople. The DNR understand this, once they see that the fish and the lakes are taking a beating, which some are now. I feel that reading all of the replies, this is a great topic and maybe someone should write an article or something on this. At least get a buzz going, so that these guys in federal, state and local goverment see that HEY, we need more lakes and rivers for these guys and gals to fish.
We also need more musky guides, more tackle shops and more gear. This will come in due time. Look at the Salmon Charters on Lake Michigan, they are so many and granted all are screaming that they do not have enought business, just like I do not have enought student. None of them are closing up shop. They might move there boat from one harbor to the other. More musky guides will help teach new musky fisherpeople the proper way to fish and handle these fish. I fished bass for over 25 years and once I took my first musky guide trip and just the phone call with the guide, helped my understand there is a huge difference. Tackle shops, granted tuff sell, but once we get more people active in this sport the demand will be there. Gear, improvement will come with demand. Golf Clubs have taken on whole new shapes and went from wood to metal and now to all differnt types of heads. Why? Demand, money was spent because the demand was so HIGH for new golf clubs to IMPROVE the players enjoyment. So the companys saw a market and spent money in that market. Why should musky reels be improved when companys only sell small amounts. Once the reels start selling, the more improvement we will see.
Mike Hulbert and I talked two days ago, about selling my reels. I have only had these Abu's 6500 C4's for less than three months (I have 11). Two I am sending back to get fixed, the other 9 are fine and work great. To have two going bad in three months is not good. I will be selling these on ebay or here if someone wants to buy them, have the boxes and everything. The reason, I want a reel that will last. After talking with Mike and also Chris Walker and Mike Ice, it does not sound like there are too many reels out there that will last. I am going to go with what Mike Hulbert is using now. Give them a try...Once we get more people buying reels, the products will get better. Its a pretty good scam, make a $90 reel that will last only 3-11 months have to get it repaired or say piss on it (like mack said) and buy a new one. If golf clubs where made that way I would get out of running a golf course and open up a golf shop.....
My 3 Cents.....
Bob
Edited by pgaschulz 12/3/2004 10:07 AM
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Posts: 1086
| Bob,
Not meaning to hi-jack this thread, but...I've been an avid Abu Garcia fan for years. Sure..I've had my ups and downs with their reels...but like anything else I own, I use it and I abuse it and it wear things out. Nothing's made to last forever.
But I'll take you up on your offer to buy a few of your 6500 C4s off of you. I'm in the market for a few more. I was just going to pop for a couple more C4s and a few C3s...but if I can snag a few from you..that'd help. :thumbsup:
Speaking of which..I still have an Abu to pick up from Ye Olde Tackle Box that was repaired weeks ago. I'll be up next Friday.
[email protected] |
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Posts: 376
Location: Lake Vermilion Tower, MN | In my opinion there is only one group of people that stand to benifit, from this expanding interest in muskie fishing.
That's the people that make money from muskie fishing, like me. 
More baits, better equipment?.....Where will it end?.....How many baits do you need anyway? It's like saying we need more drivers so we can get better cars.
I liked Muskie fishing better when it was just fishing.
"Ace"
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Do we need more musky fisherman/women?