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Posts: 3138
| That time of year to keep track of
We had 84 on Tonka this mourning and cut mourning short
Heard 84 on Indy and 86 on horseshoe chain.
What are you finding?? |
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Posts: 3138
| 84 on waconiai |
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Posts: 379
Location: Thief River Falls MN | 84 Beltrami County |
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Posts: 90
| Waconia 79 to 84. |
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Posts: 1516
| Not the metro but 83 on Cass |
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Posts: 1031
| Pewaukee was 82-82. Thursday afternoon. It isn't getting better anytime soon. |
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Posts: 23
| 83 on rush |
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Posts: 114
| Maybe some biologist can help me out with"why shouldn't we fish when water temps exceed 80 degrees" On West Okoboji and Spirit Lakes here in Iowa, they have buoys with water quality monitoring devices mounted on them. Just 10 minutes ago, the surface water temp on Spirit was 81 degrees with dissolved oxygen at 8.6 mg per liter which is good. On West Okoboji the surface temp was 80.6 with dissolved oxygen at 8.18 mg/liter. On West at 30 ft down the temp was 70.86 with dissolved oxygen of 6.43 mg/liter. The thermolcline on West right now is about 48 ft. So what is the reason we should be concerned about a fish dying with these oxygen levels if we catch one and don't take 10 pictures to try to get a perfect photo or do other dumb things with the fish? Anyone can monitor this data by going to WQDataLive
Edited by kapcoleo 7/8/2020 3:40 PM
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Location: Contrarian Island | a couple good articles. it's just a recommendation by many as fish have a harder time reviving in many cases in hot water..
https://www.wvgazettemail.com/outdoors/delayed-mortality-hidden-haza...
https://www.tennesseemuskyfishing.com/post/muskies-fishing-and-the-d... |
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Posts: 1983
| West is deep..Spirit lake has been above 80 for almost a week and spiked to above 84 2 of the last three days...doesn't take a biologist to know delayed mortality will only get more likely when the water gets that hot, but you can google it and get some scientific data to back it up...80 degrees is just a number..are you ok to water release Iowa great lakes fish right now if you realy "need" to fish? .probably so.especially if you were fishing only mornings...I bet oxygen gets worse if temps stay above 80 for several weeks..its just a choice most muskie fisherman make to protect the resource, and erroring on the side of caution feels like the right thing vs killing a fish..
Edited by IAJustin 7/8/2020 4:14 PM
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Posts: 3138
| Rod Ramsell s article in esox angler was the best description of what happens,,would be great if somebody still had that article and post it, but that was from years ago. |
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Posts: 28
| Not buying most quit after 80, maybe 25%, but that's generous. |
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Posts: 1983
| Interesting statement... are 80% of the Madison area Muskie fisherman still pounding the chain? Doubtful? Of course some don’t stop but some people that hunt and fish are slobs .. all I know is I put 24 in the net in June .. and haven’t and won’t wet a line for Muskies in Iowa in July or August
Edited by IAJustin 7/8/2020 7:15 PM
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Posts: 28
| What if it's 79.2 on August 7? Okay then? |
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| scp
what is your idea of when its time to quit |
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Posts: 1516
| If 80 is the cut off 79.2 should be ok |
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Posts: 1211
| I have 6 muskie lakes within 15 minutes of my house, and I drive by 3 of them at least every other day. I would say that the number of musky fisherman has been down about 75%-80%, over the last couple of weeks. Anecdotal; yes. Are there still some out there? Yes. But a lot fewer. |
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Posts: 486
Location: Northern Illinois | scp - 7/8/2020 7:37 PM
What if it's 79.2 on August 7? Okay then?
If this question is sincere and not rhetorical, the answer should be "No". 80 is not a magic number. As the temps increase, delayed mortality of stressed muskies increase. There have been several studies to support this notion. Stressed muskies have died in 70 degree water and lower. It's just that as the surface temperature increases up to and over 80, the probability of death for muskies stressed by being caught increases as well. Once the temps get to 80 plus and stay there awhile, a few days below 80 is not going to make it any more safe for the fish. |
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Posts: 69
Location: Royalton, MN | Clearwater Lake, a few miles away from Sugar Lake in Wright Co, MN, was 86+ yesterday at 5pm. Warmest water temp I've seen in the 10 years I've had my boat. |
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Location: Athens, Ohio | As the climate changes, this becomes a more timely topic. Jim Moore is my Muskies Inc Chap[ter president and also VP of fisheries and research for the national organization. He and others worked to obtain grants for a study of fish mortality during angling in warm water conditions. The study is now underway in West Virginia and Virginia. Here are excerpts from the minutes of our chapter meeting:
Dr. Kyle Hartman, a professor at WVU spoke to us about the Warm Water Dalayed Mortality Study on Southern Waters. Dr. Hartman has joined our chapter along with assisting graduate students as a show of support for us. We appreciate it. A similar study was conducted in Canada several years ago with no mortality reported. However, water temperatures on Stonewall Jackson Reservoir and the James River reach much higher levels, well over 80*F. The Canadian fish were subjected to very controlled release methods, exposed to the air less than 90 seconds after being caught in water temps less than 77*F.
Dr. Hartman hopes to tag from 40 to 55 fish with radio telemetry tags this year and next year. These fish might be captured in trap nets or by anglers. Once the study is underway we need to report tag numbers and other information fo the researchers. They may develop a survey to be completed by muskie anglers. Some of these fish may be caught multiple times. Those with smart phones may want to photograph their catch and forward it to the researchers. Posters explaining the project will be displayed.
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Now, fish with tags are being caught and released. US ACE reports the surface water temps yesterday morning on Stonewall were 86*F. Maryland and several other states are now looking into doing similar studies. From this science, will there come regulations restricting muskie fishing in certain conditions? Some states do similar restrictions during spawn, so we'll see. m |
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Posts: 114
| Thanks for the reference to the two articles. Internal excess buildup of chemicals makes sense and not the dissolved oxygen issue many of us were lead to believe. Also I never take pictures of fish unless in a tournament and rarely use a bump board.
Edited by kapcoleo 7/9/2020 7:50 AM
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Posts: 28
| hh, your question above -- I struggle to make an informed decision until there's reasonable scientific certainty supported by sufficient empirical evidence. Not just this guy (or Dr) saying 80, or that guy saying 78 or 84; I've got an article that says 86 (7.6 DO).
This leads to another follow-up: are other species affected by 80 or higher temps? Walleye? Northern? I would think so, these are large predatory gamefish that prefer cool temps. |
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Posts: 1211
| Even though Mille Lacs is catch and release only, for walleye, they suspend even that, during the high temperature time because of documented higher hooking mortality. |
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Posts: 486
Location: Northern Illinois | A somewhat dry read but informative by Sean Landsman and others:
http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.699.8381&r...
The Rod Ramsell article:
https://thenextbite.tv/handling-techniques-and-survival-of-released-... |
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Posts: 114
| I read Ramsell's article on handling and release and agree 100% with his findings especially the vertical holding of fish. I am probably opening up a can of worms, but as I watch any of the tv musky shows each and every fish they release is vertically held during the release process, some for a short time period and some longer. Are they damaging the fish or not and what is this saying to us?? |
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Location: Chisholm, MN | kapcoleo - 7/9/2020 11:26 AM
I read Ramsell's article on handling and release and agree 100% with his findings especially the vertical holding of fish. I am probably opening up a can of worms, but as I watch any of the tv musky shows each and every fish they release is vertically held during the release process, some for a short time period and some longer. Are they damaging the fish or not and what is this saying to us??
Definitely a good question. I try to immediately support the body, but you're right, it's not perfect. A fish is never meant to be out of water naturally. So it's internal organs never have gravity or a hand putting pressure on it until someone catches it. Now we know catch and release works, but that does depend on how well the fish is handled and what conditions it was caught in. Water releases should be more and more common. I'm also not a huge fan of the trout hold that people seem to be catching on to. They think they are doing the fish a favor by not handling it's gills, but really they are putting pressure on it's heart and also risk dropping it if thrashes. I don't think the benefits outweigh the costs here. Ask the steelhead guys about the trout hold. They are very specific about how to do it while not crushing it's heart. Muskies are different, they are way heavier, thus putting more pressure from your hand on it's organs. Imagine if someone picked you up by your throat. It would not be comfortable. |
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Location: Contrarian Island | yes, the vast majority don't fish for muskies in Madison with the heat we have had and water temps in the mid 80s. Of course there are some that can and do fish for muskies no matter the water temp..85/86 it doesn't matter to them. the "don't tell me when I can and can't fish" types that just snub their nose at common sense... I would say 95% of the guys or more will just give them a break.. and a few small % are either newbies and don't know better or the other type I mention above... |
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Posts: 28
| Even for Madison, I suspect your number's considerably overstated, but assuming (without deciding) that you're correct, those waters comprise a very small portion of the muskie fishing population. Probably doesn’t matter, but I'm guessing a decent percentage stop because it's too hot for them, not the fish.
Plus, it's conceivably an easier answer in the south, unlike the closer call much farther north when you're looking at 77-82 or similar fluctuations in a short timeframe.
If the expectancy is to shutdown the average Joe who takes his yearly vacation 'up north' and throws a Mepps #5 a couple hrs a day, then you're gonna be awfully disappointed. Not happening.
And let’s not be naive, 'we need those summer dollars, chief, and if they can't swim here, they'll go to...'
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Location: Contrarian Island | having fished here for over 20 yrs.. you are incorrect. but keep trying to assume you know. |
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Posts: 3138
| I hope everybody reading this takes time to read the Rod Ramsell article in RLsea s post Rod Ramsell was a Minnesota dnr fisheries worker and many consider him the architect of the West metro muskie fisheries when they were world class.and he butted heads with his superiors to give us that.I
Rod Ramsell was the best friend Metro muskie anglers ever had, and his insight was exceptional. |
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Posts: 8743
| Not that common sense prevails much these days, but I'd think most guys realize that catching a fish in July when it's 90 degrees outside and potentially killing it is not better than catching a fish when it cools down and potentially catching it again some day.
Who knows, maybe it's the same crowd that posts pictures of their fish and overstate the length by at least 10 inches. |
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Posts: 69
Location: Royalton, MN | TCESOX - 7/9/2020 9:01 AM
Even though Mille Lacs is catch and release only, for walleye, they suspend even that, during the high temperature time because of documented higher hooking mortality.
The fact that Mille Lacs walleye love that 27-33' deep zone on the edge of the mid-lake mudflats contributed to that. They get the bends. |
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Posts: 272
| July 10 Minnetonka
Big Island at 7 am temperature was 81.4
The basin was 83 when we left
Fished for bass and sunnies |
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Location: Otsego, MN | 81-82 Tonka today while bassing. |
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Location: north central wisconsin | kapcoleo - 7/9/2020 11:26 AM
I am probably opening up a can of worms, but as I watch any of the tv musky shows each and every fish they release is vertically held during the release process, some for a short time period and some longer. Are they damaging the fish or not and what is this saying to us??
This is actually a very good point and why I've been employing the 'splash down' method for a decade or so. Instead of holding the fish vertically, while taking time to bend over put it in the water, I let go of the head/gill area as I bend over, allowing the fish to 'settle' into the water horizontally. Since adopting this reduced handling method and educating our club members over the years, we've noted a quicker recovery period. I also don't hold the tail section of the fish at all at first. 80-90% of the time I gently splash them back in , they right themselves and swim away within seconds with little to no assistance, the key for us being not bump boarding(unless neccessary), and a camera ready for a couple quick snaps. Great topic, and not just for hot water.
Edited by Reef Hawg 7/18/2020 7:41 AM
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Location: MN | 72 upper St.Croix |
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Posts: 558
| Any recent metro water temps? Thanks!
Just seen in another post upper 70s on waconia. Any others?
Edited by Musky Face 7/25/2020 5:59 PM
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Posts: 3138
| It was 78 on Tonka yesterday when we started,,80 when we quit
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Posts: 717
| 81 on Indy late in the day. Keep in mind that every-ones graph will read temps a bit differently. Two years ago I had one on my bow that was about eight degrees high. |
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Location: Twin Cities Metro | Interesting. I had a steady 74 on White Bear this morning. I think my temperature sensor is pretty well-calibrated. It reads air temperature pretty accurately, anyway. I have seen a pretty steady decline in morning water temperatures since early July, consistent with our rainier and windier weather the last few weeks. |
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| 80 -81 Horseshoe chain yesterday.. |
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Posts: 144
| scp - 7/8/2020 6:56 PM
Not buying most quit after 80, maybe 25%, but that's generous.
Yeah I don't believe that most people quit at 80 either. Why should they? Every person makes his or her own choice to fish muskies in warm water conditions. It shouldn't be mandated by some unwritten bullsh#t rules. The written rule is the season is open. If you want to fish, fish. That being said, I make a personal choice to stop fishing muskies when the water gets into the upper 70s and higher because their ability to cope with and recover from being caught is lessened. There isn't a magic number where you can say "everyone should stop fishing at this temp". You can tell when the muskies are starting to struggle regaining their faculties after being caught. Many times, the water temps are well south of 80 degrees when these signs show up. This is something I think people need to experience first hand. Years ago I used to fish all summer no matter what, and I had enough prolonged and tough releases that it makes fishing them no fun.
Edited by pete619 7/29/2020 4:38 AM
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Posts: 69
Location: Royalton, MN | Some lakes are still cooking. I saw 83 on a lake well north of the metro yesterday. |
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Metro water temps???