This post is going to have a long thread...

Here are my thoughts. I have to start with just addressing the DFI motors, mostly the higher HP, as they are the ones with the real problems. Those problems are basically from '97 to '01.

I don't care for Mercury at all. I don't even like the sound of them. I've seen alot of Optis with problems, and I got burned on Evinrude Fichts, so I won't probably ever touch them again. Three powerheads in a year hurt pretty bad. They outsourced so many parts that were really critical, and the quality control was terrible. You wouldn't believe the grocery list of parts I went through on my Ficht. Everything from injectors, to oil pumps, to ECU's, to powerheads. Just junk.

I love my Yamaha HPDI, and plan on getting another one on my next boat. It is just the most dependable motor I have had, I never worry about it, and it always starts on the first turn of the key, no matter what the weather.

I do have to add that the new Evinrude products from Bombardier look promising, and Merc has seemed to really pull it together. I think that we'll be seeing great products from most all of the manufacturers within the next few years. I've heard great things about Bombardier's refinements of the Ficht, and all the mechanics I know really like it. The E-Tech motors are really impressive as well, and I understand they will eventually have it in a big block.

I just feel like Yamaha has already nailed it down, and after getting burned on a motor I spent alot of money on has left a bad taste in my mouth.

Good fishin',

Tyler

None of the questions you asked can be answered in a literal sense. ALL engine manufacturers have problems with the product they build, that is why they have a warranty. The Evinrude story was  a bit different only because OMC was in bad shape to begin with. Had they the resources and the time, the Evinrude direct injection motor problems would have been corrected there instead of at Bombardier.

What problems are you asking about? Powerhead? Lower unit? No outboard company builds 'bad' motors. Again, the OMC debacle was moved along by so many factors it isn't possible to point to only one, but outsourcing was a biggy.

The development of Direct Injection outboards was 'forced' by the EPA. All the builders were trying to make the EPA standards a reality throughout the product line in time for the deadlines. That isn't the most efficient atmosphere for developing a new technology. Yamaha, Evinrude, and Mercury all had problems with the DFI motors as they were developed. To say one had more than another has to be balanced by the number of outboards sold. In other words, percentage.

Starting a post suggesting this:

I know some of you HATE Mercury's, but then there are just as many that totally love them. Well, I want input from both of you folks.

Isn't going to get you anyhwere. I had a GMC that ran for 350000 miles. I bought another (identical) and went through 3 transmissions, two alternators, and an ECM  before the truck turned 100000 for no apparent reason. What does that mean? What if I had owned only the first truck, or perhaps only the second?

You seem to be asking about a 75 HP Mercury. If indeed it is a 1996, it is an oil injected 3 cylinder 84.6 cubic inch carbureted engine with PT&T standard. It has an 18 AMP Alternator, has Modular CDI Ignition, and weighs in at 305 pounds.. This is a time tested and proven model that will very soon be phased out due to the fact it is not 'green' enough. All those who have one will still be able to run them, but that technology will no longer be offered. Has anyone had trouble with that model? I would bet yes. Would any of those scenarios apply to the motor in question? Probably not.  Was the warranty return percentage high on that model? No, it was not.

What is important is who owned the motor, how was it maintained, what oils and fuels  were  burned in the engine and was it, or was it not, abused. The 'Classic' models were not involved with the DFI troubles in any case, no matter the brand.

Steve-

I agree and disagree to a certain extent. Mike's question can be answered in a literal sense.

There were major problems associated with specific product lines of both Evinrude and Mercury. That is why I addressed that, and not the other lines of engines, as he asked about the bigger block engines, which is now dominated by the DFI's. Of course we both know that. I addressed that so I could help him make a choice based on facts.

I don't think calling them about warranty claims will help, unless Mercury has a different policy than OMC. I talked to OMC numerous times and they told me they weren't having any problems at all with their line of Fichts. That was in 2000. Not exactly the truth. They even told their dealers that they weren't having problems.

My problem with the Ficht lines was everyones problem, not just mine. That was across the board.

The Yamaha DFI motors have not had nearly as many problems as the Opti's and Fichts. They are simply built to closer tolerances.

It's a fact that American craftsmanship is not up to par with Japanese. They start with an hour of exercise before they go to work. They don't build "Monday" or "Friday" motors. The company comes before themselves. It's just they way they are.

I just bought a new trailer from EZ-Loader. They forgot to put in reverse lights, or even holes for them, and they forgot to weld on step pads. They didn't wire it correctly, along with numerous other things.

It was built on a Friday.

We are certainly ahead of them in innovation, but when it comes down to building an engine, I don't think we can touch them.

This isn't anit-american, it's just the truth.

Good fishin',

Tyler

Good one Shep...

You know, I'm kinda torn on the Harley one, as I dig that sound. So you have me there.

You have a point about all the Mercs and Rudes out there versus Yamaha. I don't see as many and thats a valid point.

I was at my dealership last night, talking to the owner. He's a great mechanic, and so we got into it a bit about motors. He said he still gets the Mercs and Rudes back all the time for service, more for stupid stuff, quality control problems. Not as much for powerheads anymore.

He said he rarely sees the Yamaha engines in. He actually used the word never, but I'm sure they had a couple at least, who knows. I know they sell alot of them.

I do believe that the manufacturers are getting it together here in the states. I saw a new 21 foot Triton X series with a Merc 250xs last night that I'm dying to get on the water. That thing has got to run in the high 70's easy.

And yes, I have to go that fast.

Well I have to go, I want to get out this afternoon on my Yamaha YZF-R1 for one last ride before the snow flies...

=)

Tyler

Mike: 

You don't have many choices for motor mfg's anymore.  It soo bad there are not more choices like in the auto industry where you can find lemons simply by looking at resale value.  The Bomb memtioned earlier appears to be turning the ship post OMC but there was also some talk of them selling the brand....again. Just like the last sale, there are no guarantees the new owner will honor pre-sale warranties.

Mercury engineers like the others were drug into this century by the EPA.  Their first attempt at the problem was to add some hi-tech ignition systems to a old reliable 2 stroke design.  God forbid they would look outside their little box and start over again!  Several very famous people have proven that sometimes the best answer can be arrived at faster by blowing up an old design and starting over again rather then continuing to reingeer the old one.  American engineers at Mercury appear uncomfortable with that as they are the last to bring about radical new designs in the industry.  Who has the sought after 300hp motor right now?  Who has had a high HP 4-$troke on the market for several years?  Who didn't wait for the EPA to force them into more efficent cleaner motors?  Who didn't turn to another play in the indstry to make their first 4-$tokes?

I am one of the poor slobs who owns one of their first generation attempts at the EPA problem.  They call it an OptiMax.  I call it fear.  When it runs its excellent on fuel and oil.  It usually starts on 1/2 a crank on a cold day too.  However it has spent a few extended stays in the shop too.  The mechanics have a difficult time diagnosing some of the high tech stuff in theses motors.  Some start with the least expensive suspect part and move up the line until the motor starts functioning properly.  This saves Mercury money but it takes a ton of time for each part to be ordered and shipped.  If your warranty is expired this practice could lead to anecessive bill in unecessary parts.

I am going foreign on my next motor.  I can't afford a $6,000+ power head replacement and I shouldn't have to purchase a $1,600 extended warranty out of fear after paying big bucks for a motor.  Hell you can buy a used car with 1,000's more parts and man hours for less then you can buy a big block outboard and that used car will probably run longer.  The ouboard industry is ripe for change.