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Posts: 815
Location: Waukee, IA | Before I ask this question, let me first say I don't want to start a kerfuffle over pricing and brands/builders. There's enough bad noise out there and I don't think anybody wants more of that.
Why are new dive and rise baits now going for 2-10 times the price they used to? It seems 4 years ago d/r baits were a dying breed and now even mass producers of baits are selling plastic molded baits for big bucks. What gives? I've always liked suicks, and bobbie, wade's, raptor, etc have always been great, why the resurgence at a premium price? Is it just a fad? |
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Posts: 1716
Location: Mt. Zion, IL | Every year it seems to be something different. When people realize that baits are simply "tools", the fad will subside. Look at the $100+ topwater fad and how they got expensive two years ago. Look at the $100+ bucktials over the past two years. Crankbaits have gone for upwards of $250 recently. I like nice gear as much as the next guy, but no bait is worth nearly as much as a rod to me. I will stick to my old standby baits and keep everything under $30 per bait. My $10-$30 baits catch as many fish as the next guy's $100 baits. |
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| I dont see anyone catching 50's this year if they don't have a romper on while tossing a wooden stick with a Bugatti paint job. The big girls follow trends. |
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Location: Contrarian Island | it's not hard to see why there was a frenzy... get a couple of the most well known guides to throw them, catch fish on them, post them on FB as a must have lure, with low production, the demand went way up, supply way down... prices go way up... Economics 101. now it sounds like at least 1 of the bait makers had a bit of melt down, took his ball, went home and everyone on his list is fubarred... and he will probably make small batches, sell them for about 2 to 3 x what he use to ask.. nothing wrong w that per say...that's 'Merica!  one could simply get an Intimidator for ~40, weight it, and you have the same thing pretty much... |
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Posts: 735
Location: Apparently where the Muskie aren't | BNelson - 6/1/2017 8:37 AM
it's not hard to see why there was a frenzy... get a couple of the most well known guides to throw them, catch fish on them, post them on FB as a must have lure, with low production, the demand went way up, supply way down... prices go way up... Economics 101. now it sounds like at least 1 of the bait makers had a bit of melt down, took his ball, went home and everyone on his list is fubarred... and he will probably make small batches, sell them for about 2 to 3 x what he use to ask.. nothing wrong w that per say...that's 'Merica! one could simply get an Intimidator for ~40, weight it, and you have the same thing pretty much...
Welcome to the wonderful world of advertising |
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Posts: 7038
Location: Northwest Chicago Burbs | Here's my theory on this bait craze and all others: guys don't get to fish enough and when they do they rarely see the results they are hoping for, so they buy stuff. Most/many of us sit behind a desk, or work in the field, or in a factory or wherever all day long dreaming on catching big muskies. We see others doing that on new fancy "must have" baits (or bait styles) and in lieu of being able to actually go chase a fish while being work-bound, we do the next best thing: buy muskie sh*t. So the excitement of chasing a fish translates then to the excitement of buying something that will make that so much easier in the limited time available to do so.
And when you realize that the magic baits you bought don't really have magic to them and that fish catching is about skill accumulated through time on the water and focus/knowledge along with being able to fish where they swim...it's actually kind of depressing. |
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Location: Grand Rapids, MI | Slamr - 6/1/2017 9:51 AM Here's my theory on this bait craze and all others: guys don't get to fish enough and when they do they rarely see the results they are hoping for, so they buy stuff. Most/many of us sit behind a desk, or work in the field, or in a factory or wherever all day long dreaming on catching big muskies. We see others doing that on new fancy "must have" baits (or bait styles) and in lieu of being able to actually go chase a fish while being work-bound, we do the next best thing: buy muskie sh*t. So the excitement of chasing a fish translates then to the excitement of buying something that will make that so much easier in the limited time available to do so. And when you realize that the magic baits you bought don't really have magic to them and that fish catching is about skill accumulated through time on the water and focus/knowledge along with being able to fish where they swim...it's actually kind of depressing. Slap in the face with Slamr's hand of reality... love it!
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Posts: 1057
Location: Medford, WI | I would say Andrew hit the nail on the head! |
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Posts: 1141
Location: NorthCentral WI | People are idiots. I could be wrong but I suspect the fools paying hundreds for a single lure have not caught very many fish. |
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Posts: 624
Location: S.W. WI | Slamr - 6/1/2017 8:51 AM
Here's my theory on this bait craze and all others: guys don't get to fish enough and when they do they rarely see the results they are hoping for, so they buy stuff. Most/many of us sit behind a desk, or work in the field, or in a factory or wherever all day long dreaming on catching big muskies. We see others doing that on new fancy "must have" baits (or bait styles) and in lieu of being able to actually go chase a fish while being work-bound, we do the next best thing: buy muskie sh*t. So the excitement of chasing a fish translates then to the excitement of buying something that will make that so much easier in the limited time available to do so.
And when you realize that the magic baits you bought don't really have magic to them and that fish catching is about skill accumulated through time on the water and focus/knowledge along with being able to fish where they swim...it's actually kind of depressing.
Well said Slamr, People think they can buy success... Not so much. Its a humbling reality.
However, in a sport with so much down time, one better enjoy the "down" part, and having sexy lures to cast and watch helps keep one interested I guess. |
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Posts: 173
Location: Probably Minnesota that time... | Slam'r, your theory is straight cash! |
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Posts: 173
Location: Probably Minnesota that time... | I would also say, there is a big difference in how baits are made which leads to some of those prices. You have standard production baits that you can buy at any store. They catch tons of fish and have and will continue to do so for years. Readily available and pretty inexpensive, put together by machines and or multiple people. Then there are those beautifull lures with brilliant paint protected by multiple layers of epoxy. They are mostly made by guys as a hobby or part time gig. Lots of time goes into the making of each lure. Guy has a real daytime job, a family, and likes to get out fishing too. It takes time for a one man operation to produce some of these. The price reflects the time and quality, attention to detail, also that thick epoxy will make that lure last a lot longer than a typical store bought bait. Will they catch more and bigger fish? NO, if your confidence is the same in each bait. You will catch more and bigger fish on whatever bait you throw, if you throw it often, at the right place, at the right time.
Lol, this has all been stated multiple times before. |
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Posts: 1144
Location: Minnesota. | What slamr said....to a "T"!!
"S" fer Suick!! |
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Posts: 983
| I cant spend $100 on a bait...Id flip #*#*z if I lost it!!! |
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Posts: 20218
Location: oswego, il | People idolize and follow whats trending. Less thinking that way, much easier Who knew you needed to spend 500 bucks on a cooler. Yes you do!:-) |
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Posts: 815
Location: Waukee, IA | muletrain - 6/1/2017 11:26 AM
I would also say, there is a big difference in how baits are made which leads to some of those prices. You have standard production baits that you can buy at any store. They catch tons of fish and have and will continue to do so for years. Readily available and pretty inexpensive, put together by machines and or multiple people. Then there are those beautifull lures with brilliant paint protected by multiple layers of epoxy. They are mostly made by guys as a hobby or part time gig. Lots of time goes into the making of each lure. Guy has a real daytime job, a family, and likes to get out fishing too. It takes time for a one man operation to produce some of these. The price reflects the time and quality, attention to detail, also that thick epoxy will make that lure last a lot longer than a typical store bought bait. Will they catch more and bigger fish? NO, if your confidence is the same in each bait. You will catch more and bigger fish on whatever bait you throw, if you throw it often, at the right place, at the right time.
Lol, this has all been stated multiple times before.
I fully understand this and have no issue paying $60 for a custom bait, my point was that I see PLASTIC MASS PRODUCED dive and rise baits for 60 clams and I think its complete idiocy. |
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Posts: 173
Location: Probably Minnesota that time... | Lol, If I had seen that, I would agree! ToddM- Which end is the sucker on?- love that line, get it?... you've had that there for years, but seems particularly appplicable to these trends/fads. You can catch fish on anything you want to, except when they want a specific style, color, size, shape at a specific or non specific depth & that always, sometimes & never takes place.... |
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Posts: 859
Location: MN | Slamr - 6/1/2017 8:51 AM
Here's my theory on this bait craze and all others: guys don't get to fish enough and when they do they rarely see the results they are hoping for, so they buy stuff. Most/many of us sit behind a desk, or work in the field, or in a factory or wherever all day long dreaming on catching big muskies. We see others doing that on new fancy "must have" baits (or bait styles) and in lieu of being able to actually go chase a fish while being work-bound, we do the next best thing: buy muskie sh*t. So the excitement of chasing a fish translates then to the excitement of buying something that will make that so much easier in the limited time available to do so.
And when you realize that the magic baits you bought don't really have magic to them and that fish catching is about skill accumulated through time on the water and focus/knowledge along with being able to fish where they swim...it's actually kind of depressing.
Perfectly said. My dad laughs at me and all my lures. I told him I have more money then time and it's one of the few things I can do to help my sanity living in the city. I bet that's true of many folks it's retail therapy just on important stuff not clothing.  I really need about 12 baits. |
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Posts: 44
| With all due respect and no insult intended to anyone here, I can't think of much of anything associated with this sport that could be classed as inexpensive.
I drool over some of the photos of rigs on the Boats and Motors page. Most of those beauties are probably worth more than my house. (If I were to buy a rig that size my wife of 35 years would be filing divorce papers before I got it parked in the driveway, so my choice to continue fishing from a 16' boat falls under the heading of Promoting Domestic Tranquility.)
Who would have imagined that a single, high-end rod and reel combo might leave little change back from $1000? While not of that caliber, my current St. Croix rods are the most expensive rods I have ever owned yet definitely worth that investment in my estimation.
I sold an old jon boat a couple of years ago for less than I paid for my landing net and that is not to mention the cost of all the the requisite tools for a safe release.
I don't think it is much different with lures. We make choices about what works for each of us. I have invested years into learning how to make custom baits. I don't want to fish with what everyone else is using unless what they are using happens to be "on fire"! I try to show fish something different so in that vein my lures are all carved by hand. What I end up with is something relatively unique. To make 4-5 baits in this manner takes 2-3 weeks of fairly intensive effort but I choose to make that investment. Lure makers who follow this tradition and sell their wares certainly expect to be compensated for their expertise and effort.
When everything else associated with muskie fishing is so expensive why would it be surprising for lures to fall into that category as well, especially those crafted by hand? Just my 2 cents and definitely not worth more than that. |
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Posts: 2024
| You guys talking all reasonably bore me... The key is finding a fishing buddy that is as obsessed with making hand-carved lures, as he is with fishing. I won't name names (^ guy). Let him develop a great one, help him test them, and then hope he'll make you one. |
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Posts: 1039
Location: North St. Paul, MN | ARmuskyaddict - 6/1/2017 7:52 PM
You guys talking all reasonably bore me... The key is finding a fishing buddy that is as obsessed with making hand-carved lures, as he is with fishing. I won't name names (^ guy). Let him develop a great one, help him test them, and then hope he'll make you one.
I ain't a "playmaker pro staffer" for nothin'! |
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Posts: 1084
Location: Aurora | Finally!.. a chance to move up from my current status of "apprentice bater". |
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Posts: 4269
Location: Ashland WI | Sidejack - 6/1/2017 8:48 PM
Finally!.. a chance to move up from my current status of "apprentice bater".
Hate to break it to you, but you have to serve 3 years as "journeyman" bater before you make it to the level you have been shooting for.... |
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Posts: 7038
Location: Northwest Chicago Burbs | and to illustrate my point...today is my birthday, gotta do a 9 at the salt mine. so I think I'm going to do some retail therapy of up to $100 on lurrrrrss I dont need. |
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Posts: 815
Location: Waukee, IA | I guess I am about to shell out $100 on paint jobs for lures I made this winter. Two of which are dive rise, one being inspired by the all powerful tavernbrawler |
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Posts: 44
| Sidejack, does that explain why I went blind? |
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Posts: 3147
| Here's the flip side to that,,how many times have you heard guys say they have to go through 8-10 suicks to get the right one with the wiggle or death roll???. Do the math on that!. Go to a swapmeet what is the lure you see most on tables-suick & reefhawg. I'm looking to pay $100 plus for a dive and rise but I'm going to have the guy meet me at a local dock and demo it,,if it goes to the depth advertised and has that little upturned shimmy shake ill pay him off in new crisp bills.
I recently spent $250 on a turkey box call made of holly and African black Maccaster ebony but I also got a guarantee too don't like it send it back.
If the big price tag lures give you the option to return them I don't have a problem with it.
Keep walking back into Thorne bros and Rollie & Helens to return jerkbaits and you'll get the reputation of "here comes that guy" |
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Posts: 859
Location: MN | happy hooker - 6/3/2017 3:01 AM
Here's the flip side to that,,how many times have you heard guys say they have to go through 8-10 suicks to get the right one with the wiggle or death roll???. Do the math on that!. Go to a swapmeet what is the lure you see most on tables-suick & reefhawg. I'm looking to pay $100 plus for a dive and rise but I'm going to have the guy meet me at a local dock and demo it,,if it goes to the depth advertised and has that little upturned shimmy shake ill pay him off in new crisp bills.
I recently spent $250 on a turkey box call made of holly and African black Maccaster ebony but I also got a guarantee too don't like it send it back.
If the big price tag lures give you the option to return them I don't have a problem with it.
Keep walking back into Thorne bros and Rollie & Helens to return jerkbaits and you'll get the reputation of "here comes that guy"
I love swap meet suicks and reefhawgs! Just because a guy won't take the time to figure out the bait. I've picked up a lot of untouched of each on the cheap. I will admit last year I did have one reefhawg stumped me. I turned to vets of this board for tips... after that I was good to go. These wood baits are individuals not clones each has its liked and dislikes. Hey I get wanting every bait to run the same but this expensive builders won't be able to do that. |
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Posts: 815
Location: Waukee, IA | I guess I've never had a suick I couldn't tune to run well. It's not rocket appliances. |
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Posts: 8781
| I think it's a phase we all go through our first couple seasons. You go out, maybe see a few fish, maybe not. It's not like all the other fishing you've done your whole life where you always catch a fish or two. You leave the water thinking you would have caught muskies today if you had the right color or the right lure. It doesn't help when you see someone who presumably knows more than you do catch a fish, raise a fish, or just plain throwing a lure that you don't have. "Oh. I don't have a what-ever. So-and-so says they are great lures! I'd better go out and get one in every color. THEN I'll catch muskies!!"
The light went on for me on my second or third trip to Eagle. "That's a good color!" I kept hearing it over and over. "Don't change that lure." Grrr... On day three, I caught a fish on it. Then I missed a fish. Then I hooked one and lost it. Then I had one go around a bunch of times. Then I caught another one. The guys I was fishing with were throwing different lures and colors and what do you know, they were catching fish too. That night back at camp everybody said the same thing. "Yeah, we didn't see much the last few days, but we had about a two hour window this afternoon where they were everywhere!"
And I have 8 Weagles why?? |
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Dive and Rise Frenzy