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Posts: 162
| Any recommendations. Would love to get a tranx but it is not possible for myself.
Thanks |
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Posts: 1901
Location: MN | From what I hear the Revo Toro Beast 61 with the 4.9 gear ratio would perhaps be closest thing performance-wise to a Tranx PG. |
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Posts: 230
Location: St Paul, Minnesota | The 4.9:1 27 inches per crank of the Toro Beast is getting closer to the PG, it'll definitely reel in harder pulling lures faster and better than the previous lower geared Revo Toros, but here's another option:
Step 1: Buy the Daiwa Lexa 400HL (6.3:1 with 33 inches per crank). It won't pull as easy as the Tranx but it will be close-ish with a similar line retrieve rate. - $250.00
Step 2: Send it to PikeMaster of Pimp My Rod & Reel Service, and have him upgrade as much of the internals as possible and put a power handle on it. - Cost unknown.
I'm guessing that with a powerhandle and some decent internal upgrades you might be able to spend less than the beast and come up with a pretty awesome and fortified Lexa that will be up to whatever Tranx-like tasks you have in mind.
-C7 |
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Posts: 245
Location: Madison | Check out Avets SX series two speed reels. They don't have a levelwind, but if your using it only for blades it wont be a problem. |
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Posts: 1405
Location: Detroit River | I have the Lexa 400HSL-P & it can wear you out after a while of pulling in the DC10's. I'm not sure if it's my line (Cortland Master Braid 80 LB) or if its the reel but I get about 3 times the number of backlashes than I do with any of my other musky reels. The Cortland MB does dig into the spool so I'm guessing that's whats causing the backlash issue (my other reels have PP on them). I continuously adjust the reel to try to prevent the backlashes but it hasn't helped & has only decreased the casting distance. PikeMaster did send me a bearing to replace the nylon bushing that's under the cast control knob so that's the only upgrade that's been made. |
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Posts: 78
| muskyman1122 - 10/13/2015 8:11 AM
Any recommendations. Would love to get a tranx but it is not possible for myself.
Thanks
What you want is a Revo Toro 61S. Lists at $249. |
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Posts: 246
Location: Grand Marais, MN | flip the tranx upside down and reel it backwards. similar to the way bucketheads at the local dam use spinning gear upside down  |
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Posts: 2894
Location: Yahara River Chain | If you are left handed, then buy a Tranx and don't bother passing the rod from one hand to the other every time you want to cast. If you are right handed, then it becomes a little more tricky. If I wanted a dedicated rod for big blades I would get an Avet. Which model, I don't know, but guys using them say they have the power and speed for casting all day and will hold up to the rigors of pulling them big blades. Do a site search and you will find plenty of discussion about it. |
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Posts: 431
| Those Avets do have awesome specs. I've searched and read on here about them a bunch of times and the model nomenclature still confuses me. I guess Ill take another look. It stinks that they use letters for the size and for the options. Perhaps I'm just a Michigan simpleton. |
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Posts: 44
Location: Ohio | Avets are great reels. I used them in saltwater a lot and will be using them for muskie fishing. They don't have a level wind which can take some getting used to. Also the lever drag is different from the push button release.
Maybe I can help you with some research by comparing the Avet SX to the Abu Garcia Revo Toro Beast 60. The SX is the smallest and lightest model and has slightly higher capacity than the Revo Toro Beast 60. You can get a single speed and a 2-speed reel. In my opinion, the 2-speed looks interesting - almost like having two reels in one. You would get some serious cranking power from the low speed and then the high speed would be great for picking up slack line on gliders etc or burning bucktails. Both the single speed and high speed come with power handles.
If I was going to buy another Avet, I think I would look at the 2-speed SXJ 6/4 Raptor (narrow). Holds 300 yards of 30lb braid (285 for the Beast), weighs 16 oz (14 oz for the beast), 26 max lbs of drag (22 for beast), retrieves 24" in low speed (27 for beast), 39" in high speed (34" for beast), and comes standard with a power handle (paddle handle for beast). Both have magnetic cast control.
To get a new Avet SXJ 6/4 Raptor will run you around $400 - the same as the Abu Garcia Revo Toro Beast 60. But you would need a regular beast and a high speed beast to get the same performance of the Avet, so you'd be spending around $800 for the Abus. That being said, you'd have to deal with no level wind and learning a lever drag system to use the Avet effectively. |
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Posts: 2097
| Thanks for the review nick. Reviews from non sponsored users is a lot better than an employee or a person that is sponsored always plugging their products. |
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Posts: 398
Location: Wisconsin | Surprised no one has mentioned the shimano Trinidad... Without a doubt it is the closest to tranx. 46inches per turn, and has even higher quality components. Trinidads are as just as high quality as tranx, if not better |
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Posts: 2097
| Original poster was interested in a lefty. |
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Posts: 44
Location: Ohio | WiscoMusky - 10/14/2015 10:20 AM
Surprised no one has mentioned the shimano Trinidad... Without a doubt it is the closest to tranx. 46inches per turn, and has even higher quality components. Trinidads are as just as high quality as tranx, if not better
I heard that the Tranx was based on the Trinidad but in a low profile size. But the Trinidad is only made in a righty.
If you want to compare an Avet to a Tranx, I would go with the SXJ 6/4 Raptor regular width to match a similar line capacity. |
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Posts: 1100
| I love my SX raptor, awesome for straight retrieve baits, but imo not worth using for gliders. But AWESOME for blades, and rubber, with a pump of the rod once in a while, or just do 2-3 fast turn on the handle and then, reel slower again. |
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Posts: 349
| nick220722 - 10/14/2015 10:38 AM WiscoMusky - 10/14/2015 10:20 AM Surprised no one has mentioned the shimano Trinidad... Without a doubt it is the closest to tranx. 46inches per turn, and has even higher quality components. Trinidads are as just as high quality as tranx, if not better I heard that the Tranx was based on the Trinidad but in a low profile size. But the Trinidad is only made in a righty. If you want to compare an Avet to a Tranx, I would go with the SXJ 6/4 Raptor regular width to match a similar line capacity. Shimano Ocea Jigger is more or less a JDM Trinidad and left handed models are available. |
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Posts: 1100
| The Ocea jigger doesn't have a casting brake eg. centrifugal or magnetick, or am i wrong ? |
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Location: Ontario | Zinox - 10/14/2015 2:17 PM
The Ocea jigger doesn't have a casting brake eg. centrifugal or magnetick, or am i wrong ?
You are correct |
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Posts: 349
| Zinox - 10/14/2015 1:17 PM The Ocea jigger doesn't have a casting brake eg. centrifugal or magnetick, or am i wrong ? Ummm... neither do Trinidads. Like I said, a JDM Trinidad. |
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Posts: 1023
| I have had the Avet SX one speed for 4 years. Reels in tens at a very good speed easily. Is comfortable. The lack of level wind is not a huge deal. Around $200. Built like a tank. Buy extra pinion bearings - they r cheap and easy to swap out. If u crank your drag down right u will fry that gear in a summer. Buy the magic cast version for sure (magnetic brake).
I think it is the easiest reeling fastish lefty reel and fair prices. IMO. |
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Posts: 78
| nick220722 - 10/14/2015 8:03 AM
Avets are great reels. I used them in saltwater a lot and will be using them for muskie fishing. They don't have a level wind which can take some getting used to. Also the lever drag is different from the push button release.
Maybe I can help you with some research by comparing the Avet SX to the Abu Garcia Revo Toro Beast 60. The SX is the smallest and lightest model and has slightly higher capacity than the Revo Toro Beast 60. You can get a single speed and a 2-speed reel. In my opinion, the 2-speed looks interesting - almost like having two reels in one. You would get some serious cranking power from the low speed and then the high speed would be great for picking up slack line on gliders etc or burning bucktails. Both the single speed and high speed come with power handles.
If I was going to buy another Avet, I think I would look at the 2-speed SXJ 6/4 Raptor (narrow). Holds 300 yards of 30lb braid (285 for the Beast), weighs 16 oz (14 oz for the beast), 26 max lbs of drag (22 for beast), retrieves 24" in low speed (27 for beast), 39" in high speed (34" for beast), and comes standard with a power handle (paddle handle for beast). Both have magnetic cast control.
To get a new Avet SXJ 6/4 Raptor will run you around $400 - the same as the Abu Garcia Revo Toro Beast 60. But you would need a regular beast and a high speed beast to get the same performance of the Avet, so you'd be spending around $800 for the Abus. That being said, you'd have to deal with no level wind and learning a lever drag system to use the Avet effectively.
There are a couple of misconceptions here...
First off, the Toro Beast *may* have a lower total drag number but it will produce more drag smoothly and not destroy pinion bearings like an Avet.
As well, the Toro Beast comes with 3 handles (paddle, balanced power and long jigger) that will move D10's with ease and have better options for other styles.
Lastly, there is always the Toro S 61 that is much less expensive.
Honestly, an Avet Raptor is a great reel and may work for some for muskies, but a reel like the Toro S is going to be a joy to use in comparison (casting ease and line lay) and will handle any muskie that ever lived unless Jurassic Muskie is still alive :).
If you are going to consider an Avet, a single speed would be a better choice imo. |
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Posts: 44
Location: Ohio | johndtuttle - 10/14/2015 5:34 PM
nick220722 - 10/14/2015 8:03 AM
Avets are great reels. I used them in saltwater a lot and will be using them for muskie fishing. They don't have a level wind which can take some getting used to. Also the lever drag is different from the push button release.
Maybe I can help you with some research by comparing the Avet SX to the Abu Garcia Revo Toro Beast 60. The SX is the smallest and lightest model and has slightly higher capacity than the Revo Toro Beast 60. You can get a single speed and a 2-speed reel. In my opinion, the 2-speed looks interesting - almost like having two reels in one. You would get some serious cranking power from the low speed and then the high speed would be great for picking up slack line on gliders etc or burning bucktails. Both the single speed and high speed come with power handles.
If I was going to buy another Avet, I think I would look at the 2-speed SXJ 6/4 Raptor (narrow). Holds 300 yards of 30lb braid (285 for the Beast), weighs 16 oz (14 oz for the beast), 26 max lbs of drag (22 for beast), retrieves 24" in low speed (27 for beast), 39" in high speed (34" for beast), and comes standard with a power handle (paddle handle for beast). Both have magnetic cast control.
To get a new Avet SXJ 6/4 Raptor will run you around $400 - the same as the Abu Garcia Revo Toro Beast 60. But you would need a regular beast and a high speed beast to get the same performance of the Avet, so you'd be spending around $800 for the Abus. That being said, you'd have to deal with no level wind and learning a lever drag system to use the Avet effectively.
There are a couple of misconceptions here...
First off, the Toro Beast *may* have a lower total drag number but it will produce more drag smoothly and not destroy pinion bearings like an Avet.
As well, the Toro Beast comes with 3 handles (paddle, balanced power and long jigger ) that will move D10's with ease and have better options for other styles.
Lastly, there is always the Toro S 61 that is much less expensive.
Honestly, an Avet Raptor is a great reel and may work for some for muskies, but a reel like the Toro S is going to be a joy to use in comparison (casting ease and line lay ) and will handle any muskie that ever lived unless Jurassic Muskie is still alive : ).
If you are going to consider an Avet, a single speed would be a better choice imo.
thanks for your input. I can't say I disagree with you that the beast and revo toro s would be easier to fish with. I believe they would. But I'm not sure they're more like a tranx than the Avet I was discussing. You and the other posters are correct that the Avets like to eat pinion bearings. |
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Posts: 1000
| Toro S61 is 29 IPT
Tranx PG is 30 IPT
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Posts: 44
Location: Ohio | Yep those two are similar but there is a big difference in line capacity between the Toro S and the Tranx 500 - if that matters. |
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Posts: 1100
| tswoboda - 10/14/2015 3:56 PM
Zinox - 10/14/2015 1:17 PM The Ocea jigger doesn't have a casting brake eg. centrifugal or magnetick, or am i wrong ? Ummm... neither do Trinidads. Like I said, a JDM Trinidad.
The 12 and 14 does. |
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Posts: 2026
| How far do you guys think you are actually casting for line pickup to be a big issue? And do you really lose much line from a musky pulling drag??? That seems to be just another silly argument musky guys cling to. I believe the line pickup on the Toro S, or Beast, isn't based on a completely full spool...
http://muskie.outdoorsfirst.com/board/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=10...
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Posts: 2097
| It's a silly argument comparing a toro s to a tranx pg. A closer argument would be a beast low speed vs tranx pg. The tranx pg still picks up more line as well. If you cast 50 yards the tranx would have your 10's back to the boat while the other guys bait with the beast would be 50' away. |
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Posts: 386
| Avet SX Raptor all the way! |
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Posts: 125
Location: Barnesville MN | It's a silly argument comparing a toro s to a tranx pg. A closer argument would be a beast low speed vs tranx pg. The tranx pg still picks up more line as well. If you cast 50 yards the tranx would have your 10's back to the boat while the other guys bait with the beast would be 50' away.
Ok If my math is right 50 yards is 1800 inches if the Tranx is 30 inches per turn it would take 60 turns , Beast 4.9 is 27 inches per turn so it would take 66.75 turns that would leave a little over 15 feet difference not 50 but maybe I am missing something. |
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Posts: 32926
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | 2labradors - 10/15/2015 10:18 AM
It's a silly argument comparing a toro s to a tranx pg. A closer argument would be a beast low speed vs tranx pg. The tranx pg still picks up more line as well. If you cast 50 yards the tranx would have your 10's back to the boat while the other guys bait with the beast would be 50' away.
Ok If my math is right 50 yards is 1800 inches if the Tranx is 30 inches per turn it would take 60 turns , Beast 4.9 is 27 inches per turn so it would take 66.75 turns that would leave a little over 15 feet difference not 50 but maybe I am missing something.
You are, actually.
Average cast is way under 150'. That's half a football field. The Toro S 50 brings in 26" per turn, and if you fill the spool up, more. Average cast is about 60' unless bomb casting, which most folks don't do much of with bucktails. It isn't JUST about speed, 'fast' can be fast enough at 27 turns per retrieve average, and is for me. I just spent a day in the boat with herbie tossing 10s allot, used the S 60, and was very pleased. |
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Posts: 2097
| 2labradors - 10/15/2015 11:18 AM
It's a silly argument comparing a toro s to a tranx pg. A closer argument would be a beast low speed vs tranx pg. The tranx pg still picks up more line as well. If you cast 50 yards the tranx would have your 10's back to the boat while the other guys bait with the beast would be 50' away.
Ok If my math is right 50 yards is 1800 inches if the Tranx is 30 inches per turn it would take 60 turns , Beast 4.9 is 27 inches per turn so it would take 66.75 turns that would leave a little over 15 feet difference not 50 but maybe I am missing something.
Take into consideration spool size and the extra tourque the pg has. On the average it will be around a 50' difference. Take i consideration how much braid will be left on the beast after a home run cast.
I am tossing dadsons so that is where ny extra distance comes in. |
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Posts: 32926
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | cave run legend - 10/15/2015 8:53 AM
It's a silly argument comparing a toro s to a tranx pg. A closer argument would be a beast low speed vs tranx pg. The tranx pg still picks up more line as well. If you cast 50 yards the tranx would have your 10's back to the boat while the other guys bait with the beast would be 50' away.
As answered above. No one throws 'home run' casts every cast, and the S spools plenty of line. I bet one of my average casts doesn't quite bring the line to where ABU measures. No backlashes, smooth as silk, fits my hands great, excellent drag, not fatiguing to use, and I can buy the S and Veritas rod for about retail of that reel alone.. so it's my 'go to' in rotation with a Beast 60 on a St. Croix Legend Elite and a Beast 50 on a Fantasista now. You fish a PG...great! Have at it. The fish don't give a crap.
Buy the reel you like, based upon comfort, performance, and your budget.
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Posts: 72
| Sorry for off topic:
Could you compare the Abu Fantasista to a Legend Tournament or a Legend Elite?
Thanks |
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Posts: 125
Location: Barnesville MN | Exactly what Steve said buy what you like I have had alot of reels over the years Shimano tranxs , trinidads, toriums, calcuttas, Diawa lexas, saltists etc. I think Abu hit a home run with the Beast I have two 60's now and I will be trying an S. Comfortable to use and very smooth.
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Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | LugiAustria - 10/15/2015 12:03 PM
Sorry for off topic:
Could you compare the Abu Fantasista to a Legend Tournament or a Legend Elite?
Thanks
The Fantasista is a very nice rod. Well built, and in the longer models, two piece which is nice. The actions are correct, guide placement dead on, reel seat and handle length correct. Overall, a great rod, and priced correctly. Close to the LT in pretty much all categories. Hold both in your hand, and decide for each action if one suits better than another. I found that the differing actions and lengths created preferences for both brands, and I am extremely fussy.
The St. Croix Legend Elite is in a class all by itself. It's truly an experience the first time one puts that rod into use. It's also priced correctly; just the guides are over $100 at factory cost.
The Veritas impresses. Great rod at a great price. |
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Posts: 72
| Thanks Steve,
sounds great. Hope they will be available in europe. |
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Posts: 1100
| Maybe in like 2-3 years :/ |
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Posts: 1283
| nick220722 - 10/14/2015 10:22 PM
Yep those two are similar but there is a big difference in line capacity between the Toro S and the Tranx 500 - if that matters.
You will never need more line capacity then the Toro Beast or S 60s have muskie fishing. I use mono backing and 150yrds 80lb braid no issues what so ever casting and with 25# of drag no muskie is going to spool you. |
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Posts: 162
| i've been looking at the sx raptor.. looks like a pretty sweet reel. is the levelwind going to screw me if i use it for rubber. i plan on putting it on a TI xxxh for cowgirls and dussas. |
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Posts: 1100
| I used the Avet sx rapot for rubber, takes a bit of getting used to but works fine, when you figure it out, also great for blades. |
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Posts: 1749
Location: Mt. Zion, IL | sworrall - 10/15/2015 12:22 PM
LugiAustria - 10/15/2015 12:03 PM
Sorry for off topic:
Could you compare the Abu Fantasista to a Legend Tournament or a Legend Elite?
Thanks
The Fantasista is a very nice rod. Well built, and in the longer models, two piece which is nice. The actions are correct, guide placement dead on, reel seat and handle length correct. Overall, a great rod, and priced correctly. Close to the LT in pretty much all categories. Hold both in your hand, and decide for each action if one suits better than another. I found that the differing actions and lengths created preferences for both brands, and I am extremely fussy.
in all categories? more than 3 oz heavier per rod does not put a rod in LT "category" LT rods are one piece and are significantly lighter than the new ABU rods. They may be nice, but they are definitely not LT rods. |
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Posts: 162
| Is their any difference between the sx and sxj raptor? |
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Posts: 121
Location: Forest Lake, MN & Bemidji, MN | The 'j' stands for jigging. It is a much narrower spool. Unbelievably compact, easy to palm and powerful. I really like mine and the raptor version is also a two speed so you get two different retrieve speeds in one reel both with much better drag than a non raptor. There is a learning curve but once you get it dialed in they are sweet. Chark bait can get you anything they make. I am excited to try a beast as well! |
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Posts: 32926
Location: Rhinelander, Wisconsin | RyanJoz - 10/30/2015 5:19 PM
sworrall - 10/15/2015 12:22 PM
LugiAustria - 10/15/2015 12:03 PM
Sorry for off topic:
Could you compare the Abu Fantasista to a Legend Tournament or a Legend Elite?
Thanks
The Fantasista is a very nice rod. Well built, and in the longer models, two piece which is nice. The actions are correct, guide placement dead on, reel seat and handle length correct. Overall, a great rod, and priced correctly. Close to the LT in pretty much all categories. Hold both in your hand, and decide for each action if one suits better than another. I found that the differing actions and lengths created preferences for both brands, and I am extremely fussy.
in all categories? more than 3 oz heavier per rod does not put a rod in LT "category" LT rods are one piece and are significantly lighter than the new ABU rods. They may be nice, but they are definitely not LT rods.
I said 'close', so ease your undies out of the bundle, both are fine rods and both have their position in my arsenal. I have two seasons working with the new ABU rods, and like several other muskie crazed individuals across North America, provided input on balance, handle length, action, etc. through the prototype stages.
I also said,"Hold both in your hand, and decide for each action if one suits better than another. I found that the differing actions and lengths created preferences for both brands, and I am extremely fussy."
I also work with St. Croix. The LT has been the 'gold standard' in the muskie business for quite a while, and I have and regularly use several. My Okuma reels are strapped to a couple. Good pair up, by the way. One of my Beast reels is strapped to a Legend Elite. A Toro S is strapped to another, and that by design. The other Beast I own is strapped to a Fantasista 8'2". I use both rod brands regularly and really like them both. Both feel 'right' in my hands for what I am doing. Both companies are dedicated to building a top shelf product, and both 'bothered' to design rods specifically for muskie and pike anglers. One of the differences in weight is the very fact the ABU is a two piece. They did a great job balancing that out so it is very comfortable in use.
St. Croix, TI, Abu, Okuma, and Tooth Tamer are what each considers 'good competitors'. Each company does what they do, and makes no attempt to 'copy' the others. Good people behind all of those brands.
I consider my fishing rods to be like golf clubs to a serious golfer, to steal an anology from my friend Tommy Skarlis. Each has a specific use assigned for my daily game.
I regularly am ripped on good old 'social media' (which, by the way, is what this place was designed to be before the term existed) because I use a St. Croix LTWS59MXF for crappies. 'A $300 rod for crappies???!'
Yeah. It's my favorite crappie bobber and jigging stick. My favorite tiny crankbait stick for crappies is an ABU. I hunt down the biggest crappies in any given water just like you might for muskies, and I'm serious about the sport. I like eating the 9"ers too.
As with any 'tool', how the tool balances out during use, and how it 'feels' in the hands is important to me. I don't use a 16" Stihl to cut 12" green oak for the boiler. I don't use a 20" Husqvarna to cut 4" popple. I have both, and use them both. I use a heavy break action single shot .243 for my shorter range deer hunting, and a Featherweight 7mm Mag bolt action to shoot 250 plus. One is a Winchester and the other a New England Firearms. Both are very nice rifles and meet my needs exactly. If I'm feeling like a challenge, I break out the open sights Hawken 50 cap and ball. If I want traditional mixed with modern, the Traditions stainless 50 scoped break action gets the call.
We also have a S&W M&P .223. That's used for fun. And this Spring, to shoot some Texas feral hogs. Also have a .223 Savage bolt. A bolt action purist sneers at the M&P and proclaims a .223 bolt is a finer rifle. What that sneering gent doesn't understand is I use both and like both and appreciate the craftsmanship that went into building both.
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Location: Ludington, MI | OK, assuming I want the new and improved Toro S 61 for big bucktails, are there any modifications/power handles people recommend for it? |
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Posts: 72
| You can use the jigging handle from the beast. Its longer but not counter balanced. |
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