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Posts: 2361
| Let me preface my remarks by clarifying my position as not being anti tournament as long as the tournament puts back into the resource more than it takes out.
Evidently I was the only one struck by the comic aspect of the last PMMT fiasco. One of the benefits pro tourney people like to recite is that it will help us all learn new patterns, ie like bass fishing has done over the years, although it has been a while since anything significant has come out of bass fishing tourneys for a while(my opinion).
Am I the only one that was amazed that you put X number of hopefully better than average musky fisherman together in a lake that spans several thousand acres and end up with .5X, or greater of the boats, all in the same bay dragging baits around. And then we hear what great sportsmanship was exhibitted at the event, and what a great musky factory this Lake is?
I mean, was I the only person in musky fishing LMAO when I read this stuff?
A game comes to mind...Follow the Leader.
A saying comes to mind..."if everybody's thinking the same, nobody is thinking at all".
I think we should get a break from all the trollers who always want to expound on how difficult it is to troll, for at least a 30 day moratorium, after this exhibition of acute trolling skill(throw it out and drag it).
I do note that the winners were not part of the 50 boat trolling fleet.
Am I the only one that thought this whole thing was a hoot?;-)
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| Where to start...the person who has the original thought is the only one thinking if everyone is thinking the same way; all the others are merely sharing the original thought.
Trolling...there is a certain protocal for success NORMALLY; it appears in the case mentioned that all one needed to do was throw a bait out the back and BINGO!
Patterns...I do find it odd that peeps will all put on a certain bait that is supposedly "THE" bait for the day, as if that is the only bait the fish will hit; I must admit I do it too, as I went straight to Crash's shop for a chartreuse Sledge after watching Norm cruise around w/ a "chem light" attached to his leader. He was out, so when i got home, I ordered 2 of them from R/H...
Summary...basically I have none to offer, as I can't hardly remember what all was said; me thought patterns vary greatly from minute to minute, rendering me somewhat useless 5 minutes after reading something, although I can carve a box turtle out of a bar of Ivory Soap in less than a minute...~<>: |
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Posts: 5193
| I think you can learn alot most of the winners are against the norm.Here are a few examples that I have seen in my few years in the PMTT.2001 chain of lakes wiley trolled in water that is suppose to be to murky to catch fish.2002 madison the winners cast in twenty feet of water with deep deep divers away from the crowd.2001 cave run 1st and 4th place had shootout only 2 boats in the area.2002 cass winners casted bulldawgs in open water I believe 50 feet all by their lonesomes,and 2003 shelbyville.I have seen many tourneys won and much info learned where unpressured fish are and different techniques in the PMTT.0723 |
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Posts: 1247
Location: On the Niagara River in Buffalo, NY | Firstsixfeet,
If you think there is nothing to Trolling but tossing in the crankbait and taking off,I envite you to try my home waters.Where the water gets gin clear to 35 feet and at times the only aplication that will catch fish is directly on the spot accurately positioned trolled crankbaits placed ,behind structure,points,indentations etc., in current with flow up to 7.0 mph.Casting just will not get down to the fish,jiging may give you a fast pass,but trolling using the current allows you to place baits where the fish are under those conditions.
There is a time to Troll and there is a time to Cast and Trolling can sometimes take much more skill then Casting!
Capt. Larry
Edited by LarryJones 4/22/2003 7:19 PM
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Posts: 20253
Location: oswego, il | Larry is right, there is trolling and there is trolling good. Anybody can just toss a bait and go but you won't be very productive at it. Takes patience, alot of thinking and we troll millfoil lakes so there is alot of bait cleaning going on too.
Have heard of some of the follow the leader stuff in tournaments before. Talked to these guys once who fished a tourney and their strategy was to follow around the wileys. |
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Posts: 2361
| Nawwwwwwwwwww! None of that for 30 days Cpt. Larry. I want the moratorium! I don't EVEN want to hear that stuff.
Besides, what are you suggesting about the trolling techniques of all these contestants? 
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Posts: 1247
Location: On the Niagara River in Buffalo, NY | Firstsixfeet,
Yes there were a lot of boats trolling in one tight spot,but most seen no fish at all.The reason most trolled to shallow "In The FIRSTSIXFEET" and to fast.The 3 Niagara River PMTT Teams were in that group and they did place in the top 15.They were in the Top 10 the first day,before the crowd. Capt.Larry |
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| Hmmmm. How about the guys that tripled or doubled while trolling when they had 50 boats running around them? I had the same lure on as them but they had found the speed and depth that was correct. As much as I hate to say it, it wasn't a crap shoot. |
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Posts: 929
Location: Rhinelander. | Firstsixfeet, I do not believe you fished the P.M.T.T so I don't know how you can comment as if you were there. Let me twll you for all the boats thats were in lithia springs trolling it was unreal. Tony and I trolled sunday and never one time did we have a problem with another boat. Everyone watched what they were doing and never did gripe about boats being too close or being cut off. It is a real statement to to how all the anglers that fish it get along ang the skill displayed trolling. Yes it could be called a circus but a very well run one.
Trolling is a real skill and I certainly have much to learn about it. Its not all that easy and it can be boring as all get out. My hats off to guys that have it mastered.
The team that won it did so casting and they are very good fishermen that fish shelbyville often. Steve and Dduane had it all together and did a great job.
Now as to why so many boats trolled lithia springs> The new point system. If one expects to make the invitational your going to have to boat fish period. Don't have to place high but will I believe have to catch fish in two if not 3 events. On sunday this is what everyone was after,one fish for the points.
I also tell you it was really something to see. Tony and I actually saw 15 fish caught on Sunday. I still am picturing it in my head . I do have pictures of it and when developed I will post here and on my website.
Don Pfeiffer
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Posts: 2361
| No Don, I was not there, that's why my comments are so reserved. I am sure I would have a lot more to say, had I actually been a witness. Too bad for me. I believe it would have been better than free beer.
Steve, sorry to hear you didn't catch one, ah...did this tournament bring down your average number of legals, per PMMT tourney, pretty bad?
Capt. maybe you could share the right speed and depth with Don and Steve.
I agree with you though that the first six feet is everything, dang, you should see how short I cast!!!
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| FSF, Shelbyville this time of year has a large concentration of fish in a small area. You can catch fish elsewhere if you like, but it seemed like people where catching fish. Are you soooo pround to leave an area where people are catching fish because it is too crowded. I have heard about tonka being crowded and other chains being crowded but people still fish them. Use your head, shelbyville is a lake that produces lots of fish with numerous going over 50inches. You should try it sometime...By the way trolling successfuly is much harder than casting....this opinion by someone who does both. When is the last time you trolled successfully to form your opinion...BR |
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Posts: 2361
| This afternoon. Hooked and netted an upper 40's fish, ripped the tip of the jaw off another, and watched 3 more get hooked and brought to boats by trollers who threw the bait out, stuck the rod in a holder and dragged it. Now, what's the hard part?
Use my head, for what? Trollin aint rocket science.
Use your own head please.
Please visit
www.trollerdesensitization.com and
www.Shelbyvillewasfunnynomatterwhatyousay.com
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Posts: 3913
| Ah, another anti-troller post.
FSF - I use to think that trolling was easy until I started getting serious about it. And then, I started trolling rivers with current and major structure. Ten times harder than trolling predictible structure in lakes.
One day it took me about 4 hours and countless passes to finally draw my bait across the top of one particular rock shelf, a drop off after a drop off located right next to a sheer rock wall in heavy current. My theory was that the top predator would hang under the second shelf looking up to ambush prey caught in the current and tumbling through the structure. I finally found the right combination of speed and angle and boom, hooked my biggest ever muskie.
Another time, my bro-in-law and I landed on a walleye pattern - we boated our limit and then some, all beauties. The only thing that worked was bouncing hot-n-tots along the rocky and branchy river bottom. The lure HAD to crash along the bottom to elicit a strike. You had about 1/2 second to decide if your lure hung up on a snag or a fish. If a snag, you had to let go of the line so the lure floated backward out of the crap. If you held on a moment too long, the lure usually hung up such that we had to back the whole boat to the snag.
Last, try backtrolling with a master walleye dude. Dragging those little spinners along the bottom. Takes a lot of practice to do that well.
Give it a try with someone who is very good (not me, I'm learning) and you'll see there is a lot to it.
Enough of my two cents. |
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Posts: 2361
| I just don't know Ranger. Maybe if you visit the Wizard he can grant you an advanced trolling badge for those feats. Now click your heels together three times...;) |
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Posts: 3913
| The wizard has a restraining order on me. No help there. |
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Musky Tournament Lessons for Us All. LOL. ;-)