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Posts: 118
| Got to meet Mr. Bondy yesterday at the show.....what a super informative fisherman.....he talked enthusiastically about his baits.....gave me tips on how to use them in noncurrent situations in Canada.....and his evolving theory on which rod types work best for his baits.....he never once tried to sell me a bait.....and every time I've asked a question about his baits in this forum he was one of the first to respond....nice talking to you Jon....have a great season. |
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Posts: 47
| Any chance he will be at the Minnesota musky expo? I would love to buy some baits and pick his brain as well |
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| pondigger - 2/15/2015 7:10 PM
Got to meet Mr. Bondy yesterday at the show.....what a super informative fisherman.....he talked enthusiastically about his baits.....gave me tips on how to use them in noncurrent situations in Canada.....and his evolving theory on which rod types work best for his baits.....he never once tried to sell me a bait.....and every time I've asked a question about his baits in this forum he was one of the first to respond....nice talking to you Jon....have a great season.[/QUOTE
Same here. Nice in this day and age. Got my respect for sure. |
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Posts: 719
| Wow, thank you very much guys for the kind words! Everyone I talked to was first class! As for the other show, not this year but maybe 2016. Thanks to all who took a decal or purchased a bait from the three dealers at the show. As for the deep jigging bite I will leave you with a quote to think about from Jacques Cousteau..."The world is not prepared for what is down there" |
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Posts: 1036
| Jon also donated quite a few of his top notch baits to the Milwaukee Chapter of Muskies Inc. Just great baits and a great person. Thanks a lot, Jon! Maybe we can workout a seminar with you sometime when schedules permit! |
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Posts: 1283
| Same Experience with Jon in Chicago! Cant wait to try my new Bondy baits!! |
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Posts: 12
| Ditto for the Ohio show. Jon gave me the nutshell version of how to approach St. Clair which is new to me this year. Picked up a few Jr's and wobblers. Thank you sir.
Edited by gumbygold 2/17/2015 8:51 AM
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Location: MN | Jon do you know if anyone will be selling your Royal Orba's at the MN show? I was hoping to pick a couple up from you. |
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Posts: 1283
| I got mine from Thorne Bros at the Chicago show. Jon was not even selling at his booth but thats where you get the skinny on his lures and how they work. |
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Posts: 719
| Sounds great guys! Yup at least 2 dealers will have all our stuff up in MN. Thanks again everyone. |
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Posts: 241
| "I will leave you with a quote to think about from Jacques Cousteau..."The world is not prepared for what is down there""
Awesome. I thought I was amped up for deep water before....this quote just put me through the roof. Can't wait. Great Baits. Great guy.
Backdraft
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Posts: 288
Location: Oconomowoc, WI | pondigger - 2/15/2015 7:10 PM
Got to meet Mr. Bondy yesterday at the show.....what a super informative fisherman.....he talked enthusiastically about his baits.....gave me tips on how to use them in noncurrent situations in Canada.....and his evolving theory on which rod types work best for his baits.....he never once tried to sell me a bait.....and every time I've asked a question about his baits in this forum he was one of the first to respond....nice talking to you Jon....have a great season.[/QUOTE
Thats great! I regret not stopping by his booth.
That's what shows used to be like before all the bait companies sold their stuff from their booths. Makes it harder for Rollie's and the rest rest to sell products purchased from manufacturers.
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Location: Eastern Ontario | pondigger - 2/15/2015 8:10 PM
Got to meet Mr. Bondy yesterday at the show.....what a super informative fisherman.....he talked enthusiastically about his baits.....gave me tips on how to use them in noncurrent situations in Canada.....and his evolving theory on which rod types work best for his baits.....he never once tried to sell me a bait.....and every time I've asked a question about his baits in this forum he was one of the first to respond....nice talking to you Jon....have a great season.
Jon or Ponddigger could you share a little more on this ....."his evolving theory on which rod types work best for his baits".... |
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Posts: 4
| horsehunter - 3/9/2015 7:33 AM
pondigger - 2/15/2015 8:10 PM
Got to meet Mr. Bondy yesterday at the show.....what a super informative fisherman.....he talked enthusiastically about his baits.....gave me tips on how to use them in noncurrent situations in Canada.....and his evolving theory on which rod types work best for his baits.....he never once tried to sell me a bait.....and every time I've asked a question about his baits in this forum he was one of the first to respond....nice talking to you Jon....have a great season.
Jon or Ponddigger could you share a little more on this ....."his evolving theory on which rod types work best for his baits"....
Bumping this question as I'm curious as well.
I'm planning to experiment much more with vertical jigging Muskies this next year, Thanks! |
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Posts: 719
| Well, when I first started doing the deep jigging over 15 years ago I knew it was a heavy duty deal as I was dealing with big fish, right under the boat. My idea was to use the old short jerkbait rods that where 6 to 6 1/2ft. I soon found out after four broken rods, all on the hooks set, that I needed something else. In fact when I called the rod company who sponsored me and talked to the owner, they did not believe me that I had broken those rods just setting on a fish. But this was no ordinary 'fish chasing the bait down and a hook being set' scenario. It was big fish t boning the bait straight under me with what could have been the equivalent if wire line. As you know the braid does not give. So I went to 7 1/2 to 8 ft rods and did not break a rod ever again on a hook set until last June when a client broke one on a big fish. That's like 14 years without breaking another one just by going longer. Plus that extra length allows me to sweep up more line when one bites, which if they bite at the top of the lift, will sure come in handy. Now here is the change...For years I've been using and recommending long rods that were as tough as a pool cue. I'm mean no give. I describe it as a big mean technique where a big mean out fit is needed. I even got ahold of a few saltwater Ugly Stiks and used them for years (caught my PB on it) But I think it has cost me some big fish over the years. A rod with no give at all allows the bait to go slack during a small percentage of the battle, like right after the hook set. A good example is try bass fishing with a drop shot rig... you will lose a ton of fish with a rod that has no give. Nowadays I'm leaning on heavy duty rods but most of the heavy duty part is in the bottom end. The top one third is not soft by any means but just a little bit more than medium right in that sweet spot I guess. A fairy wand will lose a lot of fish...just as many as a big boy rod so I shoot for the higher end of 'in between' I guess you could say. Well enough if my typing, I've got a trip in the morn. Thanks all, Jon |
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Posts: 58
| Well since this thread is already going im just going to piggyback on it. I got on a fantastic big pike bite in ND this summer jigging deep with Bondy Baits. Horrible hook up ratio, but the bites nearly took the rod out of your hand every time! I used the Jr. bondys on a sling blade and lip stick, i bet my % was 1 out of 7 bites, it was awful. Any advice on converting more of the bites into boated fish? It wasnt a matter of fish getting off, it was a WAM! GONE! all one split second. Most bites came on a pause between lifts so i had good hook setting position and low rod angle when most bites occurred. |
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Posts: 431
| A lot of guys rig a stinger on the top of the bait. there are threads on here about it if you do a search I bet you'll even find pictures. |
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Posts: 431
| Here's one
http://muskie.outdoorsfirst.com/board/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=82... |
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| Bondy - 12/7/2015 8:13 PM
Well, when I first started doing the deep jigging over 15 years ago I knew it was a heavy duty deal as I was dealing with big fish, right under the boat. My idea was to use the old short jerkbait rods that where 6 to 6 1/2ft. I soon found out after four broken rods, all on the hooks set, that I needed something else. In fact when I called the rod company who sponsored me and talked to the owner, they did not believe me that I had broken those rods just setting on a fish. But this was no ordinary 'fish chasing the bait down and a hook being set' scenario. It was big fish t boning the bait straight under me with what could have been the equivalent if wire line. As you know the braid does not give. So I went to 7 1/2 to 8 ft rods and did not break a rod ever again on a hook set until last June when a client broke one on a big fish. That's like 14 years without breaking another one just by going longer. Plus that extra length allows me to sweep up more line when one bites, which if they bite at the top of the lift, will sure come in handy. Now here is the change...For years I've been using and recommending long rods that were as tough as a pool cue. I'm mean no give. I describe it as a big mean technique where a big mean out fit is needed. I even got ahold of a few saltwater Ugly Stiks and used them for years (caught my PB on it) But I think it has cost me some big fish over the years. A rod with no give at all allows the bait to go slack during a small percentage of the battle, like right after the hook set. A good example is try bass fishing with a drop shot rig... you will lose a ton of fish with a rod that has no give. Nowadays I'm leaning on heavy duty rods but most of the heavy duty part is in the bottom end. The top one third is not soft by any means but just a little bit more than medium right in that sweet spot I guess. A fairy wand will lose a lot of fish...just as many as a big boy rod so I shoot for the higher end of 'in between' I guess you could say. Well enough if my typing, I've got a trip in the morn. Thanks all, Jon I couldn't agree more...Big Nasty has been my Vertical Jig go to for quite awhile now. Perfect combination of hook set power and enough play in the tip to keep a fish pinned.... |
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Posts: 719
| Spent two hours of my day today jigging two Bondy's at once. Not sure what I would have done if one would have bit. Got them jigging with one rod later and I stuck em good. No guts no glory!
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Posts: 1084
Location: Aurora | Sounds like Tackle Industries MH & XH 9 foot or longer might fit the bill too.
Doesn't James test each batch by hurling cinder blocks with um? |
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Posts: 4053
Location: Land of the Musky | Sidejack - 12/8/2015 4:45 PM
Sounds like Tackle Industries MH & XH 9 foot or longer might fit the bill too.
Doesn't James test each batch by hurling cinder blocks with um?
I need to have a 4lb Bondy built to test my rods on 
LOL |
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Posts: 1405
Location: Detroit River | Sidejack - 12/8/2015 5:45 PM Sounds like Tackle Industries MH & XH 9 foot or longer might fit the bill too. Doesn't James test each batch by hurling cinder blocks with um? I've used both of my MH & XH TI rods for jigging Bondy's & I lost far too many fish with the XH. The MH keeps them pinned but most of the time the bait falls out in the net when jigging with the MH. I prefer a 8' or 8.6' heavy. Back in June I broke my 8.6' heavy Okuma jigging a Bondy when I set the hook on a snag that came up 3 feet off the bottom. I have a 8' Heavy MHX rod blank sitting in my basement that I need to stop procrastinating & build before the June opener. |
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Posts: 1100
| Zib, is the TI XH to stiff? i used the TI xxh and it was a lot better then my Big bawg and sling blade.
The best one i used so far is the MI 8 foot 10oz, but was actually considering getting a TI xh instead. |
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Posts: 1405
Location: Detroit River | Zinox - 12/9/2015 2:58 PM Zib, is the TI XH to stiff? i used the TI xxh and it was a lot better then my Big bawg and sling blade. The best one i used so far is the MI 8 foot 10oz, but was actually considering getting a TI xh instead. For vertical jigging Bondy baits it's too stiff IMO. I had to use my TI XH after the guides cracked on the Black River rod that I used to use. I was losing too many fish with the XH because I believe I was ripping the bait out of the fish's mouth to often plus when fight fish in the current on the Detroit River the stiffer rod wouldn't keep enough tension on the fish. With more bend in the tip of the rod it kept the hooks pinned in the fishes mouth a lot better. The XH might give a little better hookset but when vertical jigging the fish hits the bait so hard & clamps down that you have a hard time moving the bait in the fishes mouth to get the hooks dug in no matter what rod you're using.
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Posts: 719
| Zib is all seeing and all knowing. I've seen his hook sets. Another description might be that with too stiff a rod the bait and hooks might sort of 'bounce' off the roof of the fishes mouth rather than being eased into it where the hook points can catch and start their digging. Sounds good anyways... |
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Posts: 921
Location: Apollo, PA | Jon, I hope you can recommend some long rods that would work great with your bait, or better yet, design your own rod with a company that would hit the nail on the head.
I'm sure not the first to think of it........ congrats on a great bait and much success! |
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Posts: 719
| I've thought about doing up rods, but right now I have no time. Today we jigged with St Croix Mojo's in model number...MM80HF. Action wise it works for me, don't care for the split grip when jigging. It seems the smooth graphite part slides off your body when tucking the rod under your arm when you are settling in for a day if jigging. Works great for casting though. |
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Posts: 246
| Found an Area 51 Royal Orba a few weeks ago when I was loading my boat. Bait had been hanging for a while since the hooks were rusty but the rest of the bait was fine, No teeth marks or hook cuts. Within 15 minutes of using it this past weekend I got smacked by a good sized fish dragging and jigging it along the bottom in 30ft of water. Got the fish all the way to the boat before it somehow flipped me the fin and swam away. I have ordered another one and a regular bondy to see what lies beneath. |
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Posts: 1100
| Anyone of you ever tried using 80lb or so mono, if the softer rods are preferred maybe the stretch in the mono could help as well ?. |
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Posts: 719
| Thanks for throwing that Royal! Been an awesome seller. As for the mono I would lean towards like 100 or more flouro but I'm not sure what would happen really. I'm afraid that the shock of setting the hook would break it like it did rods for me. Might be wrong but if you have less that 30 ft out and use a snap type hook set it could possibly break. You truly might be on to something though! |
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Posts: 1405
Location: Detroit River | Zinox - 12/16/2015 4:48 AMAnyone of you ever tried using 80lb or so mono, if the softer rods are preferred maybe the stretch in the mono could help as well ?. I prefer the sensitivity of the braid. When I'm jigging in the DR I can feel the difference when I get even just one zebra mussel on my hook with the braid. I would think that I'd risk snapping the line if I used mono for jigging. When the fish hit's on the down stroke of the jig the bite can be felt in your forearm, especially when it's a big fish. When that happens your arm will hurt from the fish striking. It's a great feeling to have. Also the thinner diameter of the braid helps keep you more vertical when jigging in the river because there's less drag on the line in the current. Though when you're using a 7 oz. jig staying vertical is a lot easier than using a 5/8 oz. walleye jig. |
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Posts: 1100
| Of course the thinner diameter of the braid is a massive plus for staying vertical in flowing water.
Don't think there's a change that one is going to snap 90lb+ mono on the hook set, simply because of the flexibility in the material, afaik that is also the reason lots of shark/saltwater big fish anglers still use think mono, to have a buffer in the system when using the short super stiff rods. But there is only one way to find out, might buy a spool of 300 feet sufix mono leader in 100lb and spool my Avet with it, and give it a go. |
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| What an absolute great discussion. A bit off topic but a guy was talking about losing fish on short line trolling and was told to go to longer forgiving rod to keep fish pinned. Same principle as above I assume.
Thanks for making me think a bit here |
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| No need to go 100 lbs in mono or fluoro.......30 - 40 is plenty as long as a heavier leader is used. The stretch in mono/fluoro will absorb much of the energy that would break a no stretch, similar test braid. Braid OK, there you need heavier test.
Its tough to find good med action rods in heavier weights with the exception of trolling rods but, thats what I would use if braid is preferred. Fast action rods would benefit from 40lbs mono in a jigging situation.
Better than half my rod inventory is made up of med action rods now cause I like braid but it took me a while to find them.
Take a lesson from bass fisherman......they cast their larger cranks with 40- 60 lbs braid but their mono/fluoro is usually in the 20 lbs range. Get a wind knot on lesser braid and kiss your lure good bye...braid cannot absorb shock like mono can. |
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Posts: 1100
| The reason i wanted to go with the heavy mono, was to have less stretch then the 60lb eg. i use some 60lb for trolling when the temperatures get around zero, and i'm sure i would hold up fine for jigging, but its really stretchy which was why i was thinking some really heavy would be fine in between the braid and thin mono |
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Posts: 1100
| A 30-35 feet 80lb wind on leader might be plenty give for the fish to gets hooked and not ripping the bait out of the mouth, my target jigging depth if usually between 40-65 feet. |
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Posts: 719
| My clients can tell you that I'm constantly tinkering with something new when it comes to jigging deep so I'm definitely going to try jigging flouro next year...among many other ideas I've dreamed up but still need to try. I'll give a report on opening day. |
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| Bondy - 12/17/2015 4:39 AM
My clients can tell you that I'm constantly tinkering with something new when it comes to jigging deep so I'm definitely going to try jigging fluoro next year...among many other ideas I've dreamed up but still need to try. I'll give a report on opening day.
Heavy test fluoro will have better memory than your mother in law and frustrate you even more. 30 lbs quality mono is good enough coupled with a 100 lbs leader given a stiff action rod; slower action rods are better suited to braid. Hits near the boat...all bets off... may good luck, good drag washers and good gods be with you.
Best combo likely 65 lbs braid mainline; 20' mono 30-lbs. and 2 ft 130 fluoro...will compensate for any rod action once you get use to it.
You can likely try to be "perfect" with any technique but remember you will never be perfect in all situations. Gotta love fishing.
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