|
|
Posts: 1937
Location: Black Creek, WI | FYI... first fish of the season for me was on a Topwater. Fun Factor! |
|
| |
|
Posts: 548
Location: MN | OK here's my same old statement.
Are they catching fish because they work so much better .... or are they catching fish because they are always in the water?
As in confidence lure. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 1937
Location: Black Creek, WI | Nick, One before the other. There has always been a "new bait craze" amongst musky fisherman. Remember when the Topraider first came out? I do. It was a better mousetrap than my Tallywhacker... and it wasn't long before everyone and their brother were using Topraiders. Still a good bait, but not as good as when it was first introduced. I'm sure this bait is what inspired Lake X to create another better mousetrap with the Fat Bastard, Cannonballs, etc. Are fish more vulnerable to NEW baits? Perhaps. Then word gets out and those baits get heavily fished by many anglers. Still good baits, but once the novelty wears off (fish get conditioned?), they aren't what they used to be. The lure may remain a staple item, but it becomes just another tool in the toolbox. Will this cycle ever end? Nope. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 548
Location: MN | jlong - 6/22/2016 10:34 AM
Nick, One before the other. There has always been a "new bait craze" amongst musky fisherman. Remember when the Topraider first came out? I do. It was a better mousetrap than my Tallywhacker... and it wasn't long before everyone and their brother were using Topraiders. Still a good bait, but not as good as when it was first introduced. I'm sure this bait is what inspired Lake X to create another better mousetrap with the Fat Bastard, Cannonballs, etc. Are fish more vulnerable to NEW baits? Perhaps. Then word gets out and those baits get heavily fished by many anglers. Still good baits, but once the novelty wears off (fish get conditioned?), they aren't what they used to be. The lure may remain a staple item, but it becomes just another tool in the toolbox. Will this cycle ever end? Nope.
My post was pretty much food for thought.
I have my own answer and it follows what your saying.
Kind of like everyone is adding a little bend to the double 10's to get that click.
If they didn't come out with new lures all the time what would I spend my hard earned dollars on??> lol
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 20178
Location: oswego, il | I do believe fish get conditioned to baits. Anyone who has fished Webster over the years has seen those progressions. Baits that burn white hot and burn out. Pure bait craze. The magdawg, fuzzy duzzit, swim bait, kickin minnow and bass minnow bait crazes that produced then fell off.
Edited by ToddM 6/22/2016 12:58 PM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 1405
Location: Detroit River | I have both in my box but I'm planning on taking them out to make room for lures I have confidence in.. I've only caught a few on 10's & have NEVER caught anything on a Dawg.
Edited by Zib 6/22/2016 2:11 PM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 1405
Location: Detroit River | Juhas - 3/30/2016 4:47 PM I want the days before GoPro and Face book. That would be great. I could have my November spots all to myself if that were the case. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 395
Location: NW WI | How about a Burmek B1? I admit to buying one new and I still have it. Great action.....just never got any fish interested in it.
Edited by Ifishskis 6/22/2016 3:27 PM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 170
| A few years ago I was up at AML for a short stay and the last afternoon I was out with a buddy and I stuck a fat 49.5" on a black/chrome Vibrax. Nice way to end the trip and on the last run out...well, we went in for dinner and a crown and coke and was going to pack up. Buddy was up for the week and he said let's do one quick run before I head out. Jokingly, both he and I said, only one bait for me after sticking that last fish. I said no problem...black Vibrax it was. Went back to the same piece of structure as we saw another good fish there. Boom, I stuck a beautifully marked 46". Needless to say, a few more Crowns went down which led to a "little later" start in the AM than I was hoping for...LOL
And the double 10's were flying all week...you never know.
Edited by JimLang 6/22/2016 3:02 PM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 612
| No I don't miss them one bit |
|
| |
|
Posts: 395
Location: NW WI | Ifishskis - 6/22/2016 2:40 PM
How about a Burmek B1? I admit to buying one new and I still have it. Great action.....just never got any fish interested in it.
And YES I miss the old days. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 20178
Location: oswego, il | Zib - 6/22/2016 2:26 PM
Juhas - 3/30/2016 4:47 PM I want the days before GoPro and Face book. That would be great. I could have my November spots all to myself if that were the case.
(11040960_1675169552701777_4910797952337364517_n.jpg)
Attachments
----------------
 11040960_1675169552701777_4910797952337364517_n.jpg (73KB - 374 downloads)
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 92
| The numbers are hard to refute as said above. That being said i like my 8's and single bladed tails they still catch plenty of fish and i save the double 10's for night time and a few other conditions. Love the rubber still but my shoulders don't. Off season conditioning is the key to keeping the shot shoulders hucking the big stuff at 49 for me. That and equipment that makes it easy like St Croix big nasty. Much less effort involved in tossing that big stuff with the right rods. Its the old work smarter not harder mantra for me as i get a bit older. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 731
| How about a new twist here. Twenty years in the future, guys may ask the question, "Do you remember the days of the 10's and dawgs, and all the big fish that were caught?" Who knows what kinds of baits will be used in the future. kDAWG |
|
| |
|
Location: Contrarian Island | to JLongs posts... catching fish is FUN to me... I throw the bait I think has the best chance at getting a hit...yah, throwing topwaters is fun and all, but if they are not hitting them throwing topwater 8 hrs with no hits is no FUN (to me)...my 1st 5 fish this season with some bigger ones were all on topwater... that was FUN... but if I had caught all 5 on a dawg, that would be fun too.... catching fish is why I am on the water... if it's a double 10, a topraider, or a banjo minnow I could care less what gets the job done.... I do however miss the days pre double 10 as it made guys 'think' more that I see guys doing now... simply clip on their fav double blade and that's all they throw...to me it has taken some of the 'thinking' out of the sport....
Edited by BNelson 6/23/2016 11:41 AM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 13688
Location: minocqua, wi. | to me the days before had more to do with how old i was and who i fished with ... some great memories. our pattern was to find fish with gliders and go back to catch them on topwater. we'd spend the week at LOTW building a milk run that almost always paid off on last light. we had a tradition for the last night that you gave your fishing partner an ugly bait to throw at a fish we'd seen earlier in the week. i made the choice to make my buddy kevin throw a bulldawg knowing that it was a silly bait at the time ... fish ate it LOL. it was the original small size in black and green ... i may still have it laying around somewhere. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 1937
Location: Black Creek, WI | Brad, Yes, catching fish if fun. However, I think catching fish the way YOU want to catch them is even more fun. There are days when there are dozens of different ways to catch a musky, so why not choose the way that is most fun to you? If people think Double 10's and Bulldawgs are only or best way to catch fish on any given day... then they are not catching as many fish and having as much fun as they should be. Sometimes fish location will rule out some presentation options as well. My point here is this. My first fish of the season would undoubtedly have eaten a small bucktail had I chosen to use it. I chose to offer up a topwater because I felt it would be more fun. In some case, the bucktail may be the better option yet I'll choose the topwater AT THE RISK OF NOT CATCHING THE FISH, only because I want that specific experience to be on topwater for the fun of it. As many fish as you catch, Brad, I figured you would be all over this by now. Getting back to the original post, I don't believe Dawgs and 10's are always the BEST lure to use. Good tools, for sure, but not the only tools we need. |
|
| |
|
Location: Contrarian Island | if topwater is the most fun for you and you don't mind not catching fish then throw topwater all year!  I love topwater and get lots of hits on topwater, but at times they want the bucktail, or crankbait, or dawg, or whatever.... I let the fish tell me what they want...to me, catching them on ANY bait is fun... to each their own...
Edited by BNelson 6/23/2016 1:33 PM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 785
| I miss the days when they first came out and every big fish seemed to crush them with reckless abandon haha. If I could go back in time I think I'd be unemployed the first couple years of the cowgirl and be a traveling musky fishing hobo sticking 50's every other day |
|
| |
|
Posts: 20178
Location: oswego, il | I am with Brad on this one. the fun is catching. The fun bait is the one putting me in the best situation to catch them. I do not throw top waters and bucktails much but I have caught fish on them. I throw more erratic stuff that people are not throwing. Part of the reason people today throw alot (not every circumstance) bucktails and top waters is because it is easy. Cast and retrieve. I have seen it may times, I am catching fish on the crazy stuff, my partner wants to try and after 10 minutes they retreat to the comfort of they're bucktail. I fish alot of pressured water so my confidence is to present something they do not normally see.
Edited by ToddM 6/23/2016 3:14 PM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 1937
Location: Black Creek, WI | BNelson - 6/23/2016 1:32 PM if topwater is the most fun for you and you don't mind not catching fish then throw topwater all year! I love topwater and get lots of hits on topwater, but at times they want the bucktail, or crankbait, or dawg, or whatever.... I let the fish tell me what they want...to me, catching them on ANY bait is fun... to each their own... ; ) Topwater is not the most fun for me. I prefer catching fish in the figure8 on blades. but, I like new challenges and the visual excitement of a topwater strike now and then. My point is... we don't need Double 10's and Dawgs to catch fish today. Thus, there is no need to MISS THE DAYS BEFORE they were introduced. And that... is the topic of this discussion. If you miss those days... simply put down the Cowgirl and pick up a Shumway Flasher. Both catch many many fish.... in many of the same situations. |
|
| |
|
Location: Contrarian Island | agreed, topwater is a blast... I love it as much as anyone... and I agree we don't "need" those lures to catch fish but I also believe the # of fish, and the # of big fish would be less in my boat if I wasn't throwing those lures...
muskies are not smart, they eat whatever moves, from a 3" rapala to a 2 lb bulldawg... fun to catch no matter what lure or tactic.... |
|
| |
|
Location: Grand Rapids, MI | jlong - 6/23/2016 4:24 PM BNelson - 6/23/2016 1:32 PM if topwater is the most fun for you and you don't mind not catching fish then throw topwater all year! I love topwater and get lots of hits on topwater, but at times they want the bucktail, or crankbait, or dawg, or whatever.... I let the fish tell me what they want...to me, catching them on ANY bait is fun... to each their own... ; ) Topwater is not the most fun for me. I prefer catching fish in the figure8 on blades. but, I like new challenges and the visual excitement of a topwater strike now and then. My point is... we don't need Double 10's and Dawgs to catch fish today. Thus, there is no need to MISS THE DAYS BEFORE they were introduced. And that... is the topic of this discussion. If you miss those days... simply put down the Cowgirl and pick up a Shumway Flasher. Both catch many many fish.... in many of the same situations. Part of this discussion reminds me of a discussion we had on "Nut" many years ago about stages of an angler. One of those stages (the final stage) was that the catch itself doesn't matter, it's the how that's more important. So yes, someone may not care if they're not catching fish (not saying jlong is that way) and they may want to throw topwater all year because that's how they want to catch fish.
|
|
| |
|
Location: Contrarian Island | everyone is different..some may not get to that point Will..personally my mindset is if the thrill of catching fish diminishes to the point the "how" is more important I think I'll give up the sport.. . getting skunked is no fun...maybe some day my mindset will change but for now... the fun part is catching them...
Edited by BNelson 6/23/2016 3:59 PM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 20178
Location: oswego, il | I agree with Brad again, I do not care for getting skunked. I have a friend of mine who only wants to target big fish over 50" and will only cast. He never used to be that way. He can fish days without a follow and trips without a fish. I have another friend who won't troll and won't fish for anything but muskies. He would rather wash baits all day than catch one trolling or catch a bass. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 159
| Funny from my experience---10s and 9s ---double blades----far out perform Dawgs from my personal anicdotal experience....
Not to mention--Am I the only one that hates casting Dawgs---even Mag Dawgs---having to lob them out there--rather than the good rod load snap on a cowgirl or Jr...to me casting Pounders takes all the fun out of Musky fishing---never felt that way about Cowgirls or Jrs...
In my opinion Dawgs are by far the least fun bait to cast and work and fish with....
Perhaps the best thing related to Musky fishing I have read in a long time--was the above quote---Im paraphrasing---10 years from now we will be talking about how many fish we all caught on Cowgirls and Dawgs--as some other baits will have taken there place in the cycle of new baits...much truth to this I believe....Im guessing it won't take 10 years...
Oh and almost forgot the original question--Yes I miss those early days for me when all my fish were caught on small mepps and Bobbies----and Suicks--and Tallywakers/Teasertails/Hawgwabblers/Hawgbusters....
Edited by Storm Strike 6/23/2016 5:31 PM
|
|
| |
|
Posts: 8716
| I started about the time people were still laughing at bulldawgs, and a bit before anybody had ever heard of a cowgirl. I miss being that young. I miss the newness of it all and still being ramped up at the end of the day because I saw a fish. I miss the excitement of getting a new lure or a new color and really believing it was the ticket to catching a pile of big fish.
I don't miss thinking double 10's were going to outfish all my old #8 Shumway Flashers every day of the week. They don't. More than a few days where the only fish we caught were on something smaller, even with 10's in the water all day.
I'll throw bulldawgs when I have to because I feel like there's no better choice, just like ripping the hell out of a grandma. I'm still out there to catch fish. But I'm not going to spend a lot of time throwing a lure I don't enjoy fishing. Having a fish blow up on a tail prop 3 times in a cast is a lot more fun than the ones that rip the tail off your stupid bulldawg that you never even got to see. If the fish are really going on a certain lure? I'm not stupid - I'll throw it all day. But if it's a slow day, I'm going to enjoy my fishing. |
|
| |
|
Posts: 1126
Location: Minnesota. | jlong - 6/23/2016 12:40 PM
Brad, Yes, catching fish if fun. However, I think catching fish the way YOU want to catch them is even more fun. There are days when there are dozens of different ways to catch a musky, so why not choose the way that is most fun to you? If people think Double 10's and Bulldawgs are only or best way to catch fish on any given day... then they are not catching as many fish and having as much fun as they should be. Sometimes fish location will rule out some presentation options as well. My point here is this. My first fish of the season would undoubtedly have eaten a small bucktail had I chosen to use it. I chose to offer up a topwater because I felt it would be more fun. In some case, the bucktail may be the better option yet I'll choose the topwater AT THE RISK OF NOT CATCHING THE FISH, only because I want that specific experience to be on topwater for the fun of it. As many fish as you catch, Brad, I figured you would be all over this by now. Getting back to the original post, I don't believe Dawgs and 10's are always the BEST lure to use. Good tools, for sure, but not the only tools we need.
I'm so there...!! |
|
| |
|
Posts: 1828
| jlong - 6/23/2016 12:40 PM
Yes, catching fish if fun. However, I think catching fish the way YOU want to catch them is even more fun.
I'm doomed because after about ten years and not even 100 fish yet, I pretty much only want to catch them boatside or on top. I love to see the strike. Catching them way out on the cast is less than half as fun.
Yesterday even after four fish on other baits, I stuck with bucktails for the evening because I wanted to get one at my feet. Kind of weird but that's what I wanted. And I know it probably cost me a fish or two.
I'll still take a big one any way I can get it though! |
|
| |
|
Posts: 13688
Location: minocqua, wi. | agree with the boatside and on-top comments ... that's why smallies have my heart. topwater smallies are an absolute blast! |
|
| |
